Teachers and Lecturers

[Rheumatoid]

On what do you base this assumption?

working in health and education since 1983

 

[rovinghawk]

I can well remember being told pay rise would be something like 2% one year as the govt. needed to set an example to industry .... nothing changes....

By comparison, I haven't had a pay rise in five years despite a fairly big step up the career ladder. If I go outside my relatively protected little niche I'd find wage levels at about the same level I'd have received in 1988, assuming work could be found at all.

Many of us have little sympathy when we hear that those with massively more security of employment complain when they get rises better than private industry.

RH

 

[Duck n Dive]

By comparison, I haven't had a pay rise in five years despite a fairly big step up the career ladder. If I go outside my relatively protected little niche I'd find wage levels at about the same level I'd have received in 1988, assuming work could be found at all.

Many of us have little sympathy when we hear that those with massively more security of employment complain when they get rises better than private industry.

RH

Maybe I should have made clear .... that was way back in the days when private industry was getting high single figure (and in some cases double digit) pay rises and inflation was running around 8%.

 

[Pow-Lo]

yes and I can assure you most of them aren't the brightest or most dedicated bunch you will ever come across

You're not wrong there.

I have little sympathy for teachers although I do not wish to see anyone's retirement plans go to pot.

Most of the ones I've come across don't know shit from clay. Not surprising really, given they've spent all their lives at school. Think about it: nursery, infants, juniors, comprehensive (or grammar), university then teacher training college. They've never left fuckin' school!

Something else that pisses me off with the whole education system; my niece and nephew have not long left school. Their teachers were only allowed to correct 60% of their work so as not to damage their self-esteem. Wtf? Are you kidding me?

If you receive any form of written correspondence from the vast majority of people under 30, it will most likely be shocking. Piss poor spelling, zero punctuation and abysmal grammar. Why? The kids are being taught by fuckin' idiots who can't tell their arses from a hole in the ground!

And one day, these ill educated morons will be running the country. That is, if they aren't already.

We should follow the example of the Germans; start school earlier in the morning and finish at a commensurate earlier time then have four hours on a saturday morning. Not only do they stand a chance of learning a bit more, they'll have more time for their playstations in the evening and it'll keep the stupid women doing the school run off the roads in theose bastard 4x4s when the rest of us are commuting.

PS Before anyone takes the above as a personal affront to them, their wife/girlfriend/mother/sister/auntie/cousin/cat/whatever, please note, I said "most", not "all" and I'm writing from personal experience which is given away by the "ones I've come across".

 

[Timbo2]

working in health and education since 1983

Well we have a similar career span Rheumatoid, mine has been entirely within education and I've been involved in Initial Teacher Training for a few years as well, and whereas there may be the odd bad apple as you would expect in any trainee scheme, the quality of some of the NQT's I have been working with recently is outstanding.

 

[Timbo2]

You're not wrong there.

I have little sympathy for teachers although I do not wish to see anyone's retirement plans go to pot.

Most of the ones I've come across don't know shit from clay. Not surprising really, given they've spent all their lives at school. Think about it: nursery, infants, juniors, comprehensive (or grammar), university then teacher training college. They've never left fuckin' school!

Something else that pisses me off with the whole education system; my niece and nephew have not long left school. Their teachers were only allowed to correct 60% of their work so as not to damage their self-esteem. Wtf? Are you kidding me?

If you receive any form of written correspondence from the vast majority of people under 30, it will most likely be shocking. Piss poor spelling, zero punctuation and abysmal grammar. Why? The kids are being taught by fuckin' idiots who can't tell their arses from a hole in the ground!

And one day, these ill educated morons will be running the country. That is, if they aren't already.

We should follow the example of the Germans; start school earlier in the morning and finish at a commensurate earlier time then have four hours on a saturday morning. Not only do they stand a chance of learning a bit more, they'll have more time for their playstations in the evening and it'll keep the stupid women doing the school run off the roads in theose bastard 4x4s when the rest of us are commuting.

PS Before anyone takes the above as a personal affront to them, their wife/girlfriend/mother/sister/auntie/cousin/cat/whatever, please note, I said "most", not "all" and I'm writing from personal experience which is given away by the "ones I've come across".

Oh dear, what a load of tripe, while I entirely respect your right to an opinion, and I'm not taking it personally, I can't stand by and let you get away with that. You seem to be in an alternative universe, I don't recognise this at all, you don't live in London do you? Most students these days in fact take a gap year and travel, the majority of the people I work with have done other jobs. I've never heard of people marking 60% so as not damage pupils self esteem in 30 years of teaching, but of course everyone's an expert on teaching....but in reality don't know shit about it.

 

[Rheumatoid]

Well we have a similar career span Rheumatoid, mine has been entirely within education and I've been involved in Initial Teacher Training for a few years as well, and whereas there may be the odd bad apple as you would expect in any trainee scheme, the quality of some of the NQT's I have been working with recently is outstanding.

And I would agree that its not all of them. For example the large majority of the non-degree health practitioners are dedicated and want to do the job. My main issue is with the ability and dedication of SOME of those entering what are now graduate professions.

I am prepared to accept that the situation in teaching is different as I know little about them but my initial comment related to health staff that I do know a bit about.

R.

 

[gypsy]

Oh dear, what a load of tripe, while I entirely respect your right to an opinion, and I'm not taking it personally, I can't stand by and let you get away with that. You seem to be in an alternative universe, I don't recognise this at all, you don't live in London do you? Most students these days in fact take a gap year and travel, the majority of the people I work with have done other jobs. I've never heard of people marking 60% so as not damage pupils self esteem in 30 years of teaching, but of course everyone's an expert on teaching....but in reality don't know shit about it.

You must be living the dream in Dorset :yo:

 

[Pow-Lo]

Oh dear, what a load of tripe,

Tripe? Like I said at the beginning and end, MY experience. Sorry if that rains on your parade, but I take as I find and that's what I've found.

while I entirely respect your right to an opinion, and I'm not taking it personally, I can't stand by and let you get away with that. You seem to be in an alternative universe,

Alternative universe? What, like you and the rest of the hippy liberals who are sending this country down the pan?

I don't recognise this at all, you don't live in London do you?

No, I've lived in Kent for almost three years. Previous to that, apart from six months in Cape Town, I've lived my whole life in South Wales.

Most students these days in fact take a gap year and travel, the majority of the people I work with have done other jobs.

A whole year? Wow, that'll give a valuable insight to life. That may apply to most students as a collective but like I've said on more than one occasion, I can only refer to the teachers that I've had stray into my orbit. Your claim most certainly does not encompass them.

I've never heard of people marking 60% so as not damage pupils self esteem in 30 years of teaching,

So because you've never heard of it, that makes it impossible does it, hmmm? It was their comprehensive school in Essex which would be in, or very near to, Rayleigh where they live.

What is so difficult to believe about that anyway? Isn't it regularly publicised that hippy, liberal teachers want non-competitive sports and that it's "all about taking part"? On that basis, what my niece and nephew have experienced doesn't seem so unbelivable.

As a further point on the above, that will go some way to explaining why our sports stars are, generally, crap. Why have England not won a major tournament since 1966? Why has a Brit not won Wimbledon since 1066? Ok, so England one the Rugby World Cup in 2003; are they, or any of the other home nations likely to win again? Not likely. What about the Olympics? Not much happening there, apart from a few isolated individuals.

but of course everyone's an expert on teaching....but in reality don't know shit about it.

I don't claim to be an expert on teaching. Like I've said on several occasions, the ones that I've met. I'm not tarring all with one brush, just the ones I've ran across.

And that's another problem with teachers. Spend half their working life pontificating to their captive audience and somehow consider themselves ubermenschen.

Sure, you and some of your colleagues may be very good at delivering your collective syllabii and getting the kids to pass exams but in general terms, when considering the ones I've come across, I stick to one of my original points: most don't know shit from clay.

 

[Centaur]

And that's another problem with teachers. Spend half their working life pontificating to their captive audience and somehow consider themselves ubermenschen.[/COLOR]

Sadly I have to agree with this point at least.My own brother is the epitome of this tendency. Highly educated but I wouldn't trust him to post a letter. Also whilst working for Prudential as a Teachers AVC specialist I had occasion to talk to many teachers both in groups and individually. A general characteristic I found was a complete inability to make a decision. A constant request for more information, more information, more information was merely a smokescreen to avoid making a decision. I emphasise this was a generality and there were many exceptions.:-0)

 

[Pugwash]

You've just reminded me of a comment I made to my wife once, one of those nights she came home distraut at the job:

The trouble with a lot of people in teaching jobs, is they never left school. They have never worked in a professional environment where you just CANNOT say some of the things they say in school jobs.

My wife has been asked by an ex-colleague (one she does like) to take some of our animals into the school she first worked at to show the kids. A bit of an animal encounter. She was bullied out of her job there and paid a few quid to keep quiet, and bought a Macaw with some of the cash. He's going with her :yo: They won't recognise her after about 7 years, change of name, glasses, fake hair and beard. (joke about the beard).

 

[Duck n Dive]

......... bought a Macaw with some of the cash..... They won't recognise her after about 7 years, change of name, glasses, fake hair and beard. (joke about the beard).

That Macaw sounds like it's got some serious issues...

 

[Rheumatoid]

For info:

http://www.ucu.org.uk/30June

R.

 

[rovinghawk]

Enjoy your little strike, guys.

Will you be carrying little placards with slogans on them?

One question- if you strike for a few days does your pension start a few days later or do you expect the same start date despite not having worked the requisite amount of time for it?

RH

ps- The Exeter one looks like a nice day out.

 

[Rheumatoid]

Enjoy your little strike, guys.

Will you be carrying little placards with slogans on them?

One question- if you strike for a few days does your pension start a few days later or do you expect the same start date despite not having worked the requisite amount of time for it?

RH

ps- The Exeter one looks like a nice day out.

I will more likely spend the day in the pimms tent at the norfolk show:-0)

 

[Rick448]

Enjoy your little strike, guys.

Will you be carrying little placards with slogans on them?

One question- if you strike for a few days does your pension start a few days later or do you expect the same start date despite not having worked the requisite amount of time for it?

RH

ps- The Exeter one looks like a nice day out.

I would expect they will have to work the extra days or pay exrtra contributions. Well in my experience that is what i had to do.

I doubt anyone will enjoy being on strike unless they are fortunate enough to be in a position to give up their wages for the period without suffering.

 

[Timbo2]

And that's another problem with teachers. Spend half their working life pontificating to their captive audience and somehow consider themselves ubermenschen.

Sure, you and some of your colleagues may be very good at delivering your collective syllabii and getting the kids to pass exams but in general terms, when considering the ones I've come across, I stick to one of my original points: most don't know shit from clay.

So if I'm a hippy liberal that must make you a fascist right. You would no doubt be one of the first to complain if kids exam results started going down the pan, we only do as Ofsted and government dictate.
If you're not from an alternative universe then perhaps you're from a different planet...............please stay there.

ps we don't do syllabii!!?? when were you last near a school, get yourself into a school and spend a couple of days there and talk from recent experience rather than some ideas you got from the TV.

 

[Squag1]

"green hills ........" worked in 6 different practices and one construction company and in tech college for 25 years now ( am I really that old))
Summer jobs sausage factory, building site, farming, planning dept council.
Everybody thought the other guy had a better job.

Met a few - I have the 10% theory - 10% never work no matter where they are.

New guy came teaching few years ago. After a few months he said "didn't know teaching was so hard" (hard = difficult etc, the etc is important)
There are times I think practice was easier. I could prob been a partner with all the perks, car shares etc. Now the guys who though we were all idiots working for less and no perks claim we are parasites.

Don't know who they plan on educating their kids or cleaning the roads or putting out fires.

The govmnt ran a very good anti public service campaign and the media lapped it up. Guys on TV earning near the million bashing the public service. It's funny if you can see the funny side.

Yea I had a few useless lecturers to. I also saw a few useless doctors and lawyers and lorry drivers and .......................................
and as for the bankers we had to overpay to get the best ????????8rfl@

I could do the 'we lived in shoe box in middle of road' - combination of luck and hard work got me here.
All in all things aren't bad (even though I'm on my own again) - well not until the IMF take more money out of the country.

 

[Tinytim]

I can't believe this thread contains so many fekkin spelling mistakes and incorrect punctuation by the pontificators. What the fook is syllabii ? ( "unbelivable" :-0)) Ya couldn't fekkin make it up. :wank:

So then, all bankers are wankers, as are policemen, lawyers, teachers, car drivers, women, lecturers, public sector workers, private sector workers, Welsh people, Red Bird riders, motorcycli......oh no, not motorcyclists. We are the most tolerant and understanding group of citizens aren't we ? Those that hate us and call us wankers are narrow-minded and just don't understand us.

Mrs T made us into the selfish, horrible, intolerant, know it all bastids we are today.

Pardon me, I'm having a bad day.

:bang:

 

[Pow-Lo]

So if I'm a hippy liberal that must make you a fascist right.

Wrong, I'm a Tory. Oh, and there should be a comma after "fascist" and a question mark after "right".

You would no doubt be one of the first to complain if kids exam results started going down the pan, (needs a semi colon here, not a comma, tut tut) we only do as Ofsted and government dictate.

Wrong again. My concern is the increasing upward trend in pass rates when students are, very clearly, not getting any brighter. One only needs to read a communication from, or listen to most people, under thirty for this to be readily apparent.

Clearly, the dumbing down of the curriculum and exams to cover up the failings and inadequcies of some of your hippy, liberal colleagues!

Are you not aware of the basic mistakes out there? People saying "Between you and I" instead of the correct "Between you and ME" or, my personal favourite, "I could OF done that" instead of "I could HAVE done that."

Basic mistakes that even the most useless liberal hippy should have nipped in the bud at primary school!

If you're not from an alternative universe then perhaps you're from a different planet...............please stay there.

What's up, don't like reality checks? How about you try Planet Reality. Someone else had you spot on in a previous post; living the dream in Planet Dorset, was it not?

ps (PS should be in upper case) we don't do syllabii!!?? (Your punctuation really does leave a lot to be desired) when were you last near a school (Question mark here. 3/10, see me after class), get yourself into a school and spend a couple of days there and talk from recent experience rather than some ideas you got from the TV.

Presumably, kids are taught more than one subject? Each subject has it's own syllabus, the plural of which is syllabi. But you knew that, right? Maybe you're referring to curriculum.

Get myself into a school? Yeah, right. I work for a living. That said, I could probably teach the liberal hippies a thing or seventeen and possibly instill some discipline into the recalcitrant little shits that are obviously out of your control.

Ideas from the TV. As I've said on more than one occasion. I write from my experience, not someone elses. Perhaps you should learn to read.

Get real, hippy

I look forward to your next round of obfuscating drivel.