D
D.S.
Guest
Hey Sarah
shut up, you know not what you're talkin about :} Let's all listen to Fat Bert
shut up, you know not what you're talkin about :} Let's all listen to Fat Bert
-
Welcome to the new B.I.R.D. Forum. Please be sure to read the "New Member / New Registered ? Please Read" thread in the Coffee Shop. This contains some important information. To become a full member ( £5.90 a year ) simply click on your user name near the top on the right I hope you enjoy the new site ................ Jaws ( John )
Allan
Registered User
The important bit here is..
That on a track day you only do at most a 20 min session and then back in for an extended period, its not as though you are out there running a GP race.
Thus to drop your pressures by such a large amount IMHO is downright foolish.:t
You go out for a Sunday morning blat and scratch - do you drop your tyre pressures - NO, and they can be put thoriugh as much of a bashing as if you were on circuit. Go screaming down the motorway in the high 150's for a tank full of full, do you drop the pressures, NO, so why the hell do it for a 20 min session on track?:t
Todays tyres are desinged to be run at the tempature they are set at cold.(42)
If you have a race bike thats track set up - period, then yes, get some slicks on and have them at the pressure set for that set up, but we are talking road tyres.
So, leave them were they are, that way you get used to how your tyres feel when they are cold and also running at the correct temp.
You might want to stiffen the suspension up, up give yourself a bit more ride height for ground clearance though.
Buzz
That on a track day you only do at most a 20 min session and then back in for an extended period, its not as though you are out there running a GP race.
Thus to drop your pressures by such a large amount IMHO is downright foolish.:t
You go out for a Sunday morning blat and scratch - do you drop your tyre pressures - NO, and they can be put thoriugh as much of a bashing as if you were on circuit. Go screaming down the motorway in the high 150's for a tank full of full, do you drop the pressures, NO, so why the hell do it for a 20 min session on track?:t
Todays tyres are desinged to be run at the tempature they are set at cold.(42)
If you have a race bike thats track set up - period, then yes, get some slicks on and have them at the pressure set for that set up, but we are talking road tyres.
So, leave them were they are, that way you get used to how your tyres feel when they are cold and also running at the correct temp.
You might want to stiffen the suspension up, up give yourself a bit more ride height for ground clearance though.
Buzz
D
D.S.
Guest
Allan said:
Because the heat thats generated in a 20 minute session on track is far, far, far greater than you'll ever achieve on a road!
E
Eff Bee
Guest
oh dear...sorry i dont do this for a living...fell asleep when being trained by pirelli...:bang:
I only do 6 lappers sometimes and you wouldnt pay me to run on road pressures!. Regardless of whether or not its 20 mins or an hour your tyres will have reached higher pressures within 5 mins. TBH i ride quick but i doubt even i could give my tyres as much of a hard time on the road as you could even running a bike in round a track. You are using the side of the tyres for prob 70% of the time round brands hatch, i doubt its even close to 30% on the road.
Dont even get me onto the slicks PSI temps...the ones i am recommending are for road tyres. For race road legal tyres you would want to run even less as they have a softer side wall and will heat up even more.
Tbh running higher pressures is dangerous..your tyres WILL overheat and cause tearing. Overheated tyres WILL stop working as they should and you WILL end up on your arse.
Unless you have been trained or definatly know what your talking about i suggest you dont give advice when it could affect someones safety.
Also as for stiffening the suspension, how do you know that the settings he currently has arent too hard anyway?. You dont just stiffen suspension..you adjust rebound as a starter...then compression, not just the preload!
If anyone wants this clarified then feel free to call me on 01372 453322 and i can get you to chat to our pirelli rep, me or Steve...
Why not take advice from people that know what they are doing and are trained to give advice?. If you were a solicitor i would never tell you how to do your job..i would take advice..works the same the other way round too.
I only do 6 lappers sometimes and you wouldnt pay me to run on road pressures!. Regardless of whether or not its 20 mins or an hour your tyres will have reached higher pressures within 5 mins. TBH i ride quick but i doubt even i could give my tyres as much of a hard time on the road as you could even running a bike in round a track. You are using the side of the tyres for prob 70% of the time round brands hatch, i doubt its even close to 30% on the road.
Dont even get me onto the slicks PSI temps...the ones i am recommending are for road tyres. For race road legal tyres you would want to run even less as they have a softer side wall and will heat up even more.
Tbh running higher pressures is dangerous..your tyres WILL overheat and cause tearing. Overheated tyres WILL stop working as they should and you WILL end up on your arse.
Unless you have been trained or definatly know what your talking about i suggest you dont give advice when it could affect someones safety.
Also as for stiffening the suspension, how do you know that the settings he currently has arent too hard anyway?. You dont just stiffen suspension..you adjust rebound as a starter...then compression, not just the preload!
If anyone wants this clarified then feel free to call me on 01372 453322 and i can get you to chat to our pirelli rep, me or Steve...
Why not take advice from people that know what they are doing and are trained to give advice?. If you were a solicitor i would never tell you how to do your job..i would take advice..works the same the other way round too.
D
D.S.
Guest
some people are just too ignorant for their own good.
Don't bother Sarah, they all know better than you obviously
Don't bother Sarah, they all know better than you obviously
E
Eff Bee
Guest
yeah i know..i suppose i tried. Maybe people arent used to others giving good advice..which i didnt really need to do..the time it took to register etc.
Maybe this is why people dont bother anymorec7u8
Maybe this is why people dont bother anymorec7u8
Wolfie
Is a lunp
my road pressures are also between 38 and 40. and i like it that way. but then again i am a shit rider :bow: :bow:
sarah I will thank you for your time and advice, but as i never intend to ride on a track again, it was wasted on me sorry.
Joe bugger off to spain yer slowcoach :beer:
sarah I will thank you for your time and advice, but as i never intend to ride on a track again, it was wasted on me sorry.
Joe bugger off to spain yer slowcoach
:beer:Appreciate the input
Appreciate the input - guess the critical difference here is between Track Days where lap times matter most
and
Closed Circuit "Skills Days" where the onus [not anus] is on developing skills that you will use on the road on a day-to-day basis
To achieve the former, yes I guess you look at lowering your psi to achieve that extra 0.00005 second that makes Rossi a God
BUT on the latter it's about psuhing the envelope whilst on NORMAL road settings
As I said earlier, you wouldn't lower your normal/recommended psi to go for a Sunday morning blat - so to get the most [IMHO!!!!!] from a Closed Circuit Skills Day, I believe you should ride under NORMAL settings
But Hey - wtf do I know?
We'll leave this to the Track God's who know all :beer: :beer: :beer:
Perhaps some of those peeps going on the Avon Open Day might want to ask the question?
Appreciate the input - guess the critical difference here is between Track Days where lap times matter most
and
Closed Circuit "Skills Days" where the onus [not anus] is on developing skills that you will use on the road on a day-to-day basis
To achieve the former, yes I guess you look at lowering your psi to achieve that extra 0.00005 second that makes Rossi a God
BUT on the latter it's about psuhing the envelope whilst on NORMAL road settings
As I said earlier, you wouldn't lower your normal/recommended psi to go for a Sunday morning blat - so to get the most [IMHO!!!!!] from a Closed Circuit Skills Day, I believe you should ride under NORMAL settings
But Hey - wtf do I know?
We'll leave this to the Track God's who know all :beer: :beer: :beer:
Perhaps some of those peeps going on the Avon Open Day might want to ask the question?
Strangely enough~~~
Two of the guys on the Prestwold Circuit, last time I was there included ;-
a] Professional Race Instructor [based at Mallory] riding an R1 [earns his living riding motorcycles vert quickly]
b] High Level Police Instructor - also riding an R1 [also earns his living riding motorcycles vert quickly]
Both guys are seriously quick and competant
Yet NEITHER lowered their tyre pressures - wonder why?
Two of the guys on the Prestwold Circuit, last time I was there included ;-
a] Professional Race Instructor [based at Mallory] riding an R1 [earns his living riding motorcycles vert quickly]
b] High Level Police Instructor - also riding an R1 [also earns his living riding motorcycles vert quickly]
Both guys are seriously quick and competant
Yet NEITHER lowered their tyre pressures - wonder why?
F
frenchuk
Guest
A lot. About curtains.Fat Bert said:
1200Pete
Registered User
Eff Bee said:
Hear, hear, :yo: :yo:
My two peneth
DO take a tyre pressure gauge, then go out on your first session with a suck it and see attitude. No one can tell you what your tyre pressures should or should not be, it will depend on the track temperature, track surface, tyre make and design, riding style and speed, suspension set up and a whole host of other variables.You may want to let a couple of PSI out (I.E. 2PSI) for your first time out, then as soon as you get into the pits, check your pressures and have a look at how the tyre is looking, if it is rolling up at the edges badly it is normally running a bit running hot, don't confuse this with "graining" or cold shear, were the tyre looks like its had a hard time but there is no balling or rolling of rubber.
Feel what the bike is doing under you, generally if a tyre is getting hot it will let you know by feeling a bit "greasy" Keep an eye on them throughout the day because you should find yourself picking the pace up as the day goes on and the pressure will need adjusting accordingly.
But above all, don't worry about it and have some fun R#?
100 % with pete on this one..
Couple of pounds and check..
EFF BEE, I feel I must take you to task..
1) The tyres of which you speak and know about are not the tyres of choice by most bird riders.. This is not something that is an opinion, but a fact.. The offerings of Pirelli have been tried by many and rejected by most..
An awful lot of folk who have tried the various types have not been errrr, kind in their words shall we say.. So perhaps you should experiment with the the Bridgestone Bird specifics of the Avon Bird specifics ? ( Unless of course you already have in which case I will shut the hell up and go away to sulk )
2) The standard suspension set up on a bird is as soft as a pillow.. In fact anyone using standard settings for the road needs their bumps felt ( a pun WAS intended but its crap so ignore it ! ) unless they are a waif like 10 stone'r, but do agree you need a little extra rebound damping if you wind up the preload..
As to taking advice from people who know..
I would be a little wary about statements like that on here.. Given the presence of other major tyre company engineers and tech heads that are members, you just might piss folk off suggesting they do not know what they are talking about like that... ( but thats what a forum is about after all )..
As a matter of interest EFF BEE, could you clarify you do actually have a Bird and have it fitted with Pirelli's, and that you have tried the Bird back to back with other makes the same as other people on here have ?
Couple of pounds and check..
EFF BEE, I feel I must take you to task..
1) The tyres of which you speak and know about are not the tyres of choice by most bird riders.. This is not something that is an opinion, but a fact.. The offerings of Pirelli have been tried by many and rejected by most..
An awful lot of folk who have tried the various types have not been errrr, kind in their words shall we say.. So perhaps you should experiment with the the Bridgestone Bird specifics of the Avon Bird specifics ? ( Unless of course you already have in which case I will shut the hell up and go away to sulk
) 2) The standard suspension set up on a bird is as soft as a pillow.. In fact anyone using standard settings for the road needs their bumps felt ( a pun WAS intended but its crap so ignore it ! ) unless they are a waif like 10 stone'r, but do agree you need a little extra rebound damping if you wind up the preload..
As to taking advice from people who know..
I would be a little wary about statements like that on here.. Given the presence of other major tyre company engineers and tech heads that are members, you just might piss folk off suggesting they do not know what they are talking about like that... ( but thats what a forum is about after all
)..As a matter of interest EFF BEE, could you clarify you do actually have a Bird and have it fitted with Pirelli's, and that you have tried the Bird back to back with other makes the same as other people on here have ?
D
davet
Guest
Speaking as some one who has done afew track days and i am still not a riding god even Ben Passes me on his blackbird :bow:
All the good track day companies do provide tyre and suspention set up people on the day.
On each day i have been on tyre pressures have been reduced by varing amounts depending on track conditions and temp. This is essentail as you will come off using standard road pressures for all the resons Sharah out lined.
as to suspention its complicated so ask people who set up suspention for a living seems the most senible thing to do!! as every body and bike is differnet
Bert
I have never been on a rider skills day so i cant comment all i can say is track days are very different, tyres and the whole bike are worked very hard even if your on your first track day.
It is also usless to compare riding on the road to track days as on the road you will not reach the same speeds and the road is a dam sight more dangerous than the track :-: :beer:
All the good track day companies do provide tyre and suspention set up people on the day.
On each day i have been on tyre pressures have been reduced by varing amounts depending on track conditions and temp. This is essentail as you will come off using standard road pressures for all the resons Sharah out lined.
as to suspention its complicated so ask people who set up suspention for a living seems the most senible thing to do!! as every body and bike is differnet
Bert
I have never been on a rider skills day so i cant comment all i can say is track days are very different, tyres and the whole bike are worked very hard even if your on your first track day.
It is also usless to compare riding on the road to track days as on the road you will not reach the same speeds and the road is a dam sight more dangerous than the track :-: :beer:
R
R2B2
Guest
Mmmmmm......... this is still back and forthing a bit!
As I recall, there has been (at least) one major "off" at an earlier RSID. Does anybody know what he did with his tyre pressures??
As I recall, there has been (at least) one major "off" at an earlier RSID. Does anybody know what he did with his tyre pressures??
R2B2
If you are thinking of the guy at Miras then I wouldn't have used the tyres he had on, on my CBR 400 never mind a Bbird. I didn't see anyone at Miras checking tyre pressures at all and 99% had a great time SAFELY so relax. Unless you are a riding God you are not going to be giving your tyres anything more than a bit of brisk exercise and 42x42 is going to be fine. I believe Jaws and others who are talking in the real world and not in some Rossi dreamland!
If you are thinking of the guy at Miras then I wouldn't have used the tyres he had on, on my CBR 400 never mind a Bbird. I didn't see anyone at Miras checking tyre pressures at all and 99% had a great time SAFELY so relax. Unless you are a riding God you are not going to be giving your tyres anything more than a bit of brisk exercise and 42x42 is going to be fine. I believe Jaws and others who are talking in the real world and not in some Rossi dreamland!
D
davet
Guest
No Sam that can be right surely Honda wouldnt recommend any thing so unsafe :bang: :bang: :neenaw:Samster said: