Neglect or not?

[Samster]

Madeleine: Neglect or not?

Tonight I'm going to go to the pub up the road. I'm going to leave my three kids sleeping at home with the door unlocked and no responsible adult in the house to care for them. I'll do the same on Wednesday and Thursday night as well.

Is this neglect?

Gerry and Kate 'whiter than white' McCann left their three children like this night after night whilst they went dining and drinking. So when are they going to be charged with child neglect? Should they be charged under Portuguese or English law?

I just watched Gerry Mc carefully on the news and my gut instinct is that he's hiding a lot. I've never seen him show ANY emotion whatsoever, he blinks uncontrollably and often momentarily looks away from the camera when mentioning 'whoever' has abducted Madeleine. He's coming across as too cool, too organised and rather arrogant in my opinion.

I've had enough of listening to him now. He can expect no more understanding from me than the level of forethought that he showed for his daughter's life. Why's he flying all over the place? Does he not realise that his bloody media campaign has fucked his chances of ever seeing his daughter alive again?..... if she was abducted then the heat's too much for the abductor to give her up....... should have laid low and let the professionals to their jobs, not court the media in the way that he has. Of course, he may know exactly what happened to his daughter..................

A colleague of mine keeps mentioning how difficult it would have been to get 3 children of those ages to all go to sleep at the same time. She thinks that being doctors, the McCanns sedated the children. She also thinks that Gerry came back to check them, and anxious to get back to his food and expensive wine found Madeleine awake. Then pissed up and faced with an upset daughter who wouldn't go back to sleep lashed out and inflicted a fatal blow. So what did he do with the body? Well she thinks he enlisted the help of his other doctor friend who was next door checking his children and got him to cover for him and take the body from the apartment wrapped in a blanket (ties in with the sighting of a man carrying a body in pink pyjamas) that the Aunt keeps mentioning.

Anyway, rant over............. next time you see Mr McCann on the news study his behavioral traits careful and see what you notice...................

Oh yes and one other thing, for two professionals the McCanns have dealt with Madeleine's disappearance in a very strange way.............Visiting the Pope???!!! If it were a single parent in this situation, they would be facing charges of criminal neglect, not being sent "donations"and treated like a celebrity.

 

[bub1664]

and there was me thinking i was the only one that thought that, as you say i think the are hiding something

 

[Gforceuk]

I've always considered him a suspect..... the wife i'm not sure about but he's shifty as hell.

 

[chuffmeister]

+1 samster

 

[gerryc]

You're all off your trolley:neenaw:

probably the same ones who said lets go kick saddams arse then when realised what a stupid feckin idea it was start shouting bring the boys home after starting world war 3

"a collegue of mine says" do me a feckin favour

I remeber being left with my brothers and sisters as a nipper when on holiday it was standard practice back then.

Would you cover for a mate who'd just kiled his kid??





No didn't feckin think so feckin idiots

 

[Samster]

You know something else that's gets me that I read elsewhere, why has their been no heartfelt message to Madeleine from her parents in case she's alive and watching a TV?

Any parent desperate for their child would look straight into the camera and say something like 'stay strong darling, we're coming for you' etc etc. No, not these two quacks, they spend entire interviews talking about her as though they had lost fucking passports and travellers cheques.

How about this from Gerry's blog a day or so ago: " Kate is a keen runner and in the last few days has tried to include a run in the daily routine. Yesterday (Sat) at 7am we ran to the monument at the top of the steep cliff overlooking Praia de Luz. We reached it in 19 minutes." Unbelievable.

It's obvious to me that he's lying about some of it or all of it, the way he pauses when he's interviewed. She just looks so guilty and nervous the whole time.

I now hear it was 1hr 50mins before they called the police. Plenty of time to do what was needed.

Here's some bits of an interview transcript with Mr McCann:

?AS I THINK PEOPLE ARE AWARE, we were checking regularly on the children and it was during one of my checks that I discovered she had gone. I can't really go into any details about that?.?.................why can't you Gerry?

Q: Did the panic set in immediately? Kate says ?Yeah? ?.................so why no screaming and running around shouting and hollering?

'?.ultimately what is done is done and we continually look forward?.?..........what exactly do you mean by that then?

??the speed of the next response and the template we have set??.........how cold hearted does he sound!

??.We haven't got any firm plans. We're likely to travel in a few places in Europe but as yet, no definite plans??...............oh I see, more travel, yes. How about actually looking for your little girl?

??.The analogy that I like to use is a bit like when we were students and you'd got to your overdraft limit and you'd gone beyond it and there was just nothing left in the tank?.?...............he's on a different planet

He then goes on about putting support mechanisms in place to help him cope........... but of course he's not talking about counselors etc, he means all the lawyers and the support fund! FFS!

Perhaps he'll use some of the fund to sue me for libel.

 

[Samster]

Gerry I'm trying to stimulate discussion, the girl I sit next to has thought Maddie was killed by her father from the very beginning.......... just sharing her view. I'm unsure, but there's more to this pair than we know.

New headline: one of their party comes forward with new evidence. Why's it taken over 100 days then?

What's your take on your namesake then?

I appreciate that I'm being highly critical of the McCanns here, and my heart bleeds for Madeleine. Nothing would please me more than to be proved wrong here.

 

[roXXo]

Neglect? Certainly.

My parents never left my sister and me on our own when we were children and Carol and I never left our 2 boys on their own.

Over protective? Maybe.

Kids being taken never entered our parents our our heads, but unforeseen problems occur and children are children. They need supervision and also content minds that comes of knowing that their mam or dad is in the next room.

Too many times, we read of fires or other tragic incidents that have been instigated my young children left alone.

"When the cat's away the mice will play."

Some parents are just plain selfish and irresponsible.

 

[gerryc]

Samster I have to admit to never paying them much notice.

I only ever read about little Maddie, I thought that the publicity would have a negative effect, in that if someone abducted her with that amount of publicity thay would be forced into killing and disposing of her.
I have no interest in her parents life story and I probably would have been harder in my views if they were chavs.
but the idea that someone no matter how close would ask to cover up the murder of a kid accidental or not and agree to it just doesn't wash.

I'm maybe not reading enough of it cause I can't be doing with it, for some reason this story particularly upsets me, it makes me think if it happened to one of mine and I don't want to think like that.

 

[XXscraper]

I agree Samster although i havent caught gerry on TV much i do think something is very wrong! I also think that they know they will be prosecuted for child neglect but as long as they are in the media doing this crap like seeing the fekin pope [why the fcuk] [sorry lord no disrespect]the heat will be off them!

I'm sure i read that the mccanns are not suspects....but why :dunno:

Is it possible as i read this too that the other 2 kids didnt wake up at all when poor Madie waas discovered missing - i mean how much noise would they have made searching. I dont have kids so dont know if this could be normal or whether it suggests they were sedated too??

If she was abducted how did the perp know Madie was there, had he/she been lurking around before just waiting to strike.....doesnt make sense! How would you smuggle a little person away without screams or was she smothered and accidentally killed?

Poor Murrat and why the feck would he do it as he would be prime suspect for living so close - its all borrox!

Why cant the piss poor parents be put on a lie detector....oh yeah because theyre not suspects but 'we' all think somethings dodge?

They have lost one of their sheep through neglect but they still have 2 left in the flock! I think they should be with them looking after the ones they still have!

Their guilt is so strong and still they cant do the right thing :shooter:

 

[ogr1]

A colleague of mine keeps mentioning how difficult it would have been to get 3 children of those ages to all go to sleep at the same time. She thinks that being doctors, the McCanns sedated the children. She also thinks that Gerry came back to check them, and anxious to get back to his food and expensive wine found Madeleine awake. Then pissed up and faced with an upset daughter who wouldn't go back to sleep lashed out and inflicted a fatal blow.

Your college may have a very valid point there, maybe Madelaine had a
bad reaction to the supposed sedative and when they checked on her later
that night, she was already dead?

Again...maybe they have already buried the body and all this farting about is just sidetracking the authorities off the scent.

 

[mick the knife]

My missus made the observation on their first press release, " how the hell does she have peace of mind to do her hair, make up and put fecking earrings in "

 

[uncle shrek]

My 2p worth......

I work in child protection, and if this had been Mr & Mrs Chav they would've been investigated no doubt. Why should it be different for them?

When it was discovered that Maddie was missing MRS McCann returned to the restaurant to tell her friends!!! Would you leave the appartment with the other two children alone, knowing that the eldest had been abducted?

The McCanns compare the situation to being sat in the garden of the house while the children are in bed. Don't know about anyone else but my garden isn't 200yds away through a complex of total strangers (the distance has varied between 50 to 200 yards, and the length of time between checks from minutes to hours).

Fishier than a Harry Ramsdens supper

 

[Codbasher]

I too thought from an early time in the abduction that one or both the parents were/are involved in this...

I know we dont have access to the Police files etc, but surely to God the parents must have been checked and double checked...

For my part no way could I ever sedate either of my kids and go for a drink/meal either in a Hotel or apartment, its just not the done thing....

 

[Flying Scotsman]

This got me thinking a bit about years ago and things you remember from your childhood. I think i was about 11 or 12 in a very rural area of Scotland. My mum and dad very rarely went out, but sometimetimes they'd go to the pub. We had a dard blue Ford Zodiac (OTS 499 told you it was funny the things you remember!) and i was the oldest, with a brother and two sisters. We used to stay in the back of the car in the car park, and be plied with cokes and crisps every 20mins. This was fairly acceptable back then, but now my kids are not out of sight ever. Ive no real comment on this situation, just remember times change, and one persons acceptable is another persons never ever

 

[big sammy]

its a f**king sick world we live in and i feel guity some times having brought in this world two of my own i think theres some thing fishy going on with the whole thing ! but lets just pray that little girl gets to see her mum and dad again soon

 

[Punchy]

........We used to stay in the back of the car in the car park, and be plied with cokes and crisps every 20mins. This was fairly acceptable back then, ........

That brings back memories when I was a kid in the 50's. I used to go for a walk with mum and dad then call in the pub for a few glasses of beer. I was left sitting in the porch or outside on one of the benches with a bottle of pop and crisps or if dad was fealing flush I had a tub of winkles or mussels. Mind you murderers were hung for their crimes in those days.

Feckin do gooder, pc cnuts, tree hugging, carrot crunching, leftie twats have fecked that up good an proper...

nurse, nurse....
wheres my medication?????

sp1ttt3
.

 

[Punchy]

and as for leaving kiddies on their own, in a foreign country whilst going off for a night out down 'The Pub'??????

As far as Im concerned its neglect.... full stop. Charge the twats!!!!

s04pb0x6
.

 

[D.S.]

Anyway, rant over............. next time you see Mr McCann on the news study his behavioral traits careful and see what you notice...................

Mr McCann may have always behaviored in this way. If this is the case, the behavioral traits you observe mean nothing in isolation.
Having said that, I couldn't agree with you more about the neglect.

 

[R2B2]

Fooking hell Sam!! I can see you are outraged by this Madeleine's disappearance and it's not often, if ever, that I disagree with you.... but by heck, I'm struggling with this one.

He's coming across as too cool, too organised and rather arrogant

A typical Cardiac Consultant I'd say.

Why's he flying all over the place? Does he not realise that his bloody media campaign has fucked his chances of ever seeing his daughter alive again?..... if she was abducted then the heat's too much for the abductor to give her up....... should have laid low and let the professionals to their jobs

I think they are doing what other parents would do to maximise the publicity of their daughters disappearance given the secretive nature and lack of information coming from the Portuguese police and judiciary. I say this because they probably took advice from professionals in the UK where it has been proven [both here and in the States] that maximising publicity does yield the best chance of a missing child being found. They are particularly quick with this tactic in the States and it works very well. By contrast, my folks were in that area of Portugal soon after Madeleine's abduction and they couldn't believe the lack of information about Madeleine - there was virtually nothing! There were more posters back in Birmingham airport than there were in Portugal! I think if I was in that situation I would want as many people, in as many countries as possible, to know about her disappearance and what she looked like. If that meant me travelling about to do it because of the Police secrecy then that's exactly what I'd be doing. I would be going to every place or country that I thought Madeleine might possibly be, as would a lot of other parents I believe. Doing nothing just wouldn't have been an option.

A colleague of mine... She thinks that being doctors, the McCanns sedated the children. She also thinks that Gerry came back to check them, and anxious to get back to his food and expensive wine found Madeleine awake. Then pissed up and faced with an upset daughter who wouldn't go back to sleep lashed out and inflicted a fatal blow. So what did he do with the body? Well she thinks he enlisted the help of his other doctor friend who was next door checking his children and got him to cover for him and take the body from the apartment wrapped in a blanket...

Astonishing claims by anyone's standards. No-one knows what happened that night but what your colleague has been saying to you sounds very much like regurgitated pages from the papers.... this is a secretive investigation, the papers "know" nothing, it's 99% speculation (of which most has originated from the Portuguese tabloids, who are engaged in a particularly vicious and sustained attack on the McCanns to the point that even some of the British papers are having trouble understanding the reasons!).

Could responsible people like doctors who are parents routinely sedate their kids just to be able to go out? Was there any suggestion that the McCanns were pissed? And the speculation that a friend, another doctor, would implicate himself in a child murder at a seconds notice by carrying away her body as if he were emptying the bin is simply mind boggling. Imagine it... "oh shit, I've accidentally killed Madeleine..... here, quick, be a good mate and take her body out of the resort for me...............". Sorry, it's simply not credible, I just can't see it.

This sort of stuff is coming from the internet too - have you seen what's been written on the public forums by some folk? It's sickening. Here's a fact for you... one Lancashire paper has shut down it's entire internet forum because they were so sickened by the stuff written about the McCanns by some people.

Yes, I think they are guilty of neglect in leaving the kids alone but they won't have been the only ones. I don't believe there is a parent in the world who watches their children every minute of every day or evening how ever good the intent, it's just not possible. Whatever the circumstances, negligent or not, most, if not all parents have inevitably lost sight of their child at some point during their vulnerable years, but rarely is there a consequence that makes it the attention of the worlds media so it doesn't even get a second thought. However, look at the case of the mother of Jamie Bulger for example. She only lost sight of him for a minute, but it was enough.... should she have been charged with neglect?

So yes, I agree that the McCanns were stupid but should they be arrested for neglect? At this point I think no.... it would merely be an act of penalty to satisfy the beying crowd and it wouldn't be in the interests of Madeleine, who needs them out there to look for her.

why has their been no heartfelt message to Madeleine from her parents in case she's alive and watching a TV?

I think they have probably been advised not to do this Sam. If you think back on other child abductions there is never a tv plea directed at the child. It's always directed at the abductor. The pleas are carefully staged to apply covert emotional pressure to the caring side of an abductors personality.

I really am losing hope now that Madeleine is still alive but cling to fact that no body means she could still be.

I really don't think the McCanns have anything to do with it, they have no motive and nothing to gain. They haven't spent any of the fund money on their own needs, this was confirmed by the fund organisers the other day; in fact, none of the fund money has been spent at all yet. The McCanns are seeking advice on how best to use it in finding their daughter. If they were guilty they may be able to fool some people, but think about it, - they wouldn't be able to deceive all their family, all their friends, all their colleagues, all those around them, the British police, the Portuguese police and so on.

I accept I could be totally wrong on all this but the McCann involvement thing just doesn't hold water, it's absurd.

I wish them well in finding their daughter, the strain must be unimaginable.