Track Day advice.

[gypsy]

havent you any washing up to do ?






























%$fan

 

[roXXo]

Only done 1 trackday on my SP1 at Cadwell Park and was unsure about tyre pressures so I took the advice of Focused events/tyre people on the day. They suggested 4 to 6 psi less than I was using on the road and then see how it went. I thought that was a bit too much but talking to other guys in the paddock they assured me that it would be no problem and others less.

Anyway I dropped the pressures by 5 ps1 and I never had a problem and must admit to forgetting all about tyre pressures for the rest of the day.
I rode home 40 miles with the same pressures and to be honest I couldn't tell any difference from standard.

You can think too much about things and then it Fercks u up.

If you are a little worried about advice posted on here, although I would have no hesitation about taking advice from regular track dayers and racers, listen to advice from the event organiser at the briefing and from the professional tyre people on the day.

http://www.bikersoracle.com/blackbird/forum/showthread.php?t=18922&highlight=roxxo+track+day


The main bit of advice is ENJOY YOURSELF
:beer:

 

[roXXo]

I also rode the bike harder than I had ever done b4 and had it on it's side longer than I had ever done b4.

Track days are nothing like riding on the road.

Thinking about the Bird on the track though, my only concern is ground clearance.
I am not a knee down type of fellow but regularly scrape my toes on the road with the bird.

Perhaps those who have taken the Bird on the track can comment about ground clearance.

 

[Eff Bee]

havent you any washing up to do ?

mmm heard that one before.


I see the wit is just as good as some of the advice on here!

























%$fan[/QUOTE]

 

[Duck n Dive]

Well after all the discussion on tyres perhaps we can give the guy some tips about other things on the day


I'd suggest thinking about what you are eating and drinking. Both before the event and during.

I guess if you treat it as a "sporting" event and consume accordingly u won't go far wrong.
In any serious activity you'll probably actually work the body much harder than you realise.
If u don't make sure you're energy intake is appropriate then your judgement and concentration may well deteriorate. The danger here is it can sneak up and you can be affected before you realise, your mind will be concentrating on what you're doing and the andreniline will be kicking in. Water intake is important as you can easily dehydrate. I'm sure that the physical effort being made will not be readily apparent until it's depleted your body.

Tiredenss is the same, think about adequate rest beforehand and also how long you are travelling before/after the event. Give yourself plenty of time for both. You don;t want to be too exhausted on the way home.
After your first/familiarisation run find a quite place to sit down, close your eyes and "think/imagine" going around the track and what you will be doing at each point - concentrate on the positive's ONLY- where you want to be at each bend, braking points etc. It really makes a difference if u can do this.

I used this technique in competative sailing and it really does work. My best races were when I had given myself stacks of time to get ready, check everything and be really certain that all the gear was clean and in tip top condition. Then after going out to check the course conditions just sitting quietly away from everyone else, eyes closed feeling the wind etc and thinking about where I'd want to be at each point and what it would feel like. It really is effective.

 

[ianrobbo1]

Perhaps those who have taken the Bird on the track can comment about ground clearance.

although I've not done track days and only a few rsd's I have found that if you have your feet in the correct position, "balls of the feet on the pegs" you will be unlikely to ground out your boots, and having them in that position helps you to shift your weight around the bike easier, on the road I tend to sit with the pegs in the "insole/heel" of the boot being a bit comfier than with the balls on the pegs, just MY "umble" opinion of course but one that I feel might be of help to sort out who does the washing up and who doesn't!! :}

 

[watchman]

Enough with the tec bits

The first time I did Brands on the bird I was so worried about getting the right lines, not running off the track and having regular bog visits that it was'nt until the second track day that I even thought about tyre pressures.

Just enjoy the day and if you feel the bike is going to let go then make the right adjustments. Most track days have a chappy who is more than willing to asist in the tyre section.

For your 1st time, dont get all techincal just go and ride your bike.

MOST IMPORTANT RELAX ENJOY AND SOAK UP THE ATMOSPHERE

 

[roXXo]

I agree with you Ian and I ride with the balls of my feet on the pegs. Still grind out sometimes. Also with the Micron cans my heels get melted where they catch due to my feet being a bit further back. I aint got big feet either. Size 9
On the trackday at Cadwell I was grinding out on the SP1. I really was surprised at how much harder you ride at a trackday without really trying. You just do.
Maybe I should try the knee out syle and keep the bike a bit more upright.

I think Dave Baglee scrapes his fairing on the Bird. :bow:
:beer:

 

[Chunky Monkey]

BUT will any of this advice get the stains out of Bert's suede shoes ???? :f c7u8

 

[1200Pete]

Just as a matter of interest, Cruser, Musher and I actually done a trackday yesterday at Castle Combe.

I monitored my tyre pressures throughout the day and adjusted them accordingly. I have just taken the pressure this morning, with the tyre cold and I have 37PSI front and rear. (These are MY pressures for this particular track, conditions, temperature, weight and riding style)

This was an Invite from Avon tyres, so the ideal opportunity to gain some inside info on tyre pressures!

The official line is.....
"On track, tyre temperatures generally rise much higher than those experienced on road. If this pressure is not adjusted the tyre shape will alter due to excess pressure and will start to skip and move about on the track".

I had a long and interesting conversation this morning with Ken Tucker, the chief technical bod, the guy who has had years and years of road and racing development experience. And again the same answer, adjust your tyre pressures as necessary. If you ride slow of fairly gentle on track, you MAY be ok on standard pressures. But the faster or harder you ride, the more pressure you may have to let out!

There are a couple of pictures bellow of my Viper after yesterday at Castle combe. This is not a boast, or a "oh look at my tyres" It just shows what a tyre goes through at a track compared to the road.

 

[PsychoBikerBen]

But the faster or harder you ride, the more pressure you may have to let out!

Mmm & 31/30 worked for me THAT day so I must have been on a good pace
:yo:

Nice one Pete :-:

 

[R2B2]

So now we have an answer that nobody else has been able to give thus far. And that is the "cold" pressure to allow for correct "hot" pressure (given Pete's weight and speed). I think this analysis is the best so far! An answer based on actual findings, as they occurred.

Question now Pete is..... what was the pressure when they were hot, that gave you the 37 when they'd cooled down?

That answer will complete the puzzle for me, and I'll then be able to work out what's best for me, given the circumstances that will be prevalent on my day.

 

[Centaur]

What utter b*llocks

I went to see a man yesterday who worked for Bridgestone for six years advising racers on the specific tyres they should use and what pressure they should be set at and his response on reading the thread was as above. He then altered it to what dangerous b*llocks. He says if you are a true "racer" on a track prepared bike on full race spec suspension on supersport tyres and you know how to wring the bikes neck then maybe reduce normal road pressure by 25%. For the average bbird owner who arrives at the track, on standard suspension and does his best he recommends leaving the pressure at standard or lowering it by 2 (two) pounds at most. He pointed out that a certain gentleman with staring eyes ,had a full ACU licence, was extremely successfull BUT what he knew about tyre settings could be written on the head of a pin. An ACU licence does not make one a tyre expert. %$fan

 

[Fat Bert]

Thanks for that Bill~~~

..... For the average bbird owner who arrives at the track, on standard suspension and does his best he recommends leaving the pressure at standard or lowering it by 2 (two) pounds at most. .....

Which applies to most of us?

Does beg the question though...........

If altering the pressures according to conditions is the "Name of the Game", why do Honda always recomend 42/42?

I've trawled through the Dunlop website and all I can see is 42/42 - laden or unladen - solo or pillion

So where are these quoted "Track Day Pressures" coming from? The url would be interesting!

 

[1200Pete]

So now we have an answer that nobody else has been able to give thus far. And that is the "cold" pressure to allow for correct "hot" pressure (given Pete's weight and speed). I think this analysis is the best so far! An answer based on actual findings, as they occurred.

Question now Pete is..... what was the pressure when they were hot, that gave you the 37 when they'd cooled down?

That answer will complete the puzzle for me, and I'll then be able to work out what's best for me, given the circumstances that will be prevalent on my day.

Sorry mate, it still does not work that way. There is no magic formula, forget my pressures weight and speed.

Remember tyre pressures for the Bird are designed to be 42Psi when COLD, so when I have done my session I don't drop pressure less than 44 - 46 Psi because the tyre is now hot. Oh yea and mind the back of your hand on the hot disc :t

Best thing to do is accept the fact that there is no definitive answer you will have to just suck it and see.

 

[Allan]

Sorry mate, it still does not work that way. There is no magic formula, forget my pressures weight and speed.

Remember tyre pressures for the Bird are designed to be 42Psi when COLD, so when I have done my session I don't drop pressure less than 44 - 46 Psi because the tyre is now hot. Oh yea and mind the back of your hand on the hot disc :t

Best thing to do is accept the fact that there is no definitive answer you will have to just suck it and see.

Pete - kindly answer these for me:
When you took your pressures and dropped them, what was:-
a) how long had you been on circuit (how many laps) when you decided to check the pressures,
b) the pressure of the tyre when you took the reading, and
c) what pressure did you drop them to?

I know you say this is YOUR pressures, but I'm just interested.

finally - any idea what the normal running temp is when in use on the road?

Cheers

Buzz

 

[Centaur]

Running temp

Pete - kindly answer this:finally - any idea what the normal running temp is when in use on the road?

Cheers

Buzz

Not tripping over Pete I hope...but I specifically asked my informant about tyre temp and he pointed out that road tyres unlike race tyres are designed to run within a temperature range of over 40 degrees centigrade. Think about that one and the differing internal pressure that will cause! Honda don't say 42 lbs at an external ambient temp of X degrees...just 42 when cold. Cold as in winter and in summer...i.e from below freezing in Jan to in the 30's in August...

 

[R2B2]

so when I have done my session I don't drop pressure less than 44 - 46 Psi because the tyre is now hot.

That IS the missing answer isn't it??

So, if I understand this, when your tyres heated up, you dropped the pressure in them to 44-46? And when you fiished your day and they went cold you measured them again, out of curiosity, and they were 37?

So, 37 cold transpired to be 44-46 when hot, yeah??

 

[1200Pete]

Pete - kindly answer this:
When you took your pressures and dropped them, what was.
a) how long had you been on circuit (how many laps) when you decided to check the pressures,
b) the pressure of the tyre when you took the reading, and
c) what pressure did you drop them to?

I know you say this is YOUR pressures, but I'm just interested.

finally - any idea what the normal running temp is when in use on the road?

Cheers

Buzz

I generally check my tyre pressures after each session until I feel that I am some where up to speed. In this particular case the sessions where only about 8 laps and the track was 1.8 Ish miles long.

My pressures will not be of any use to any one because I do not know what they were cold before I went onto the track, the first time out was a three lap sighting session (speeds up to about 80Mph) My bike felt fine and the tyres were already a few Psi down from the Nurburg Ring.

There is no normal or average road temp, as once again there are so many variables. But whether your tyres are running with 42Psi in the middle of winter or 52Psi after a good ride in the middle of summer On the road this will be well within the tyres specs and will generally not really make a noticeable difference at road speeds.

I do understand what you are saying in your earlier posts Buzz, and to a large extent I fully agree with you, a lot of people do not ride a lot faster or lean a lot further than a fast road rider. Therefore completely pointless and in some cases down right dodgy to let air out of a tyre that is not working particularly hard in the first place.

All I know is even on my hardest road ride, my tyre never looks like it does after even a single track session and I also know that if I leave my tyres at standard pressure they slip and slide until I let some out :dunno:

 

[1200Pete]

That IS the missing answer isn't it??

So, if I understand this, when your tyres heated up, you dropped the pressure in them to 44-46? And when you fiished your day and they went cold you measured them again, out of curiosity, and they were 37?

So, 37 cold transpired to be 44-46 when hot, yeah??

NO!!! It's not, you are not my weight, on the same track, in the same temp ETC And my tyres were low on pressure to start with.