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What the ? This could have had serious reprocussions for the Blood Bike service

slim63

Never surrender
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Seems to me that Police force has a bit of homework to do, I for one would Question any speeding prosecution involving the Police car and officer in it, "calibrations" weren't done, also why the CPS didn't pick up on that fact, if the copper involved had himself been involved with any spurious prosecutions prior to this one, if so what was the outcome of them, ask why his "inspector" would have given the copper permission to pursue the blood bike with under age people in the cop car, as well as being a "blood bike" rather than take the reg number and follow up next day, to "discuss" with the rider any faults or misbehaviour done at the time, yes the copper was well naughty, but his own force should have been made aware of any "circumstantial" evidence that was likely to have been brought up by the blood bikers defence, prior to the court case and saving the money it cost, and the egg on the CPS and Police force's face, all this beside the stress to the Blood biker and his group.

Disclosure is the term I believe
Even though both sides are legally required to disclose any facts or evidence that may come up in a case it very rarely happens the cps have years of form for not disclosing anything that might weaken their case, a lot of the time but not always this is because the police simply don't tell them that those facts exist, look it up mate you might be surprised
 

ScottyUK

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TC - if a vehicle such as a Blood Bike can be classified as being used as an Ambulance and may have blue lights and two tones then why don't all Blood Bikes have this?

I always assummed they had to have some additional training (above and beyond the normal "Advanced" level) to be permitted to use the privilege. Is that not the case?
 

andyBeaker

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TC - if a vehicle such as a Blood Bike can be classified as being used as an Ambulance and may have blue lights and two tones then why don't all Blood Bikes have this?

I always assummed they had to have some additional training (above and beyond the normal "Advanced" level) to be permitted to use the privilege. Is that not the case?
Reading between the lines this issue may have been part of the reason that this ended up in court.

Where do doctors with green lights stand?
 

T.C

Been there, and had one
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TC - if a vehicle such as a Blood Bike can be classified as being used as an Ambulance and may have blue lights and two tones then why don't all Blood Bikes have this?

I always assummed they had to have some additional training (above and beyond the normal "Advanced" level) to be permitted to use the privilege. Is that not the case?

The regulations date back to the introducton of the 1972 Road Traffic Act an then the 1989 Road Vehicle Lighting Regs.

The regulations state that blue lights and sirens/two tones may be used and fitted

"For ambulance purposes (but not necessarily an ambulance vehicle, e.g. cave rescue) but including the movement of sick, injured or disabled people and for moving human organs which inlcudes blood and other lifes saving materials"

The only times when blue lights can be used are when responding to an emergency, at the scene of an emergency, when wanting to let people know you are there or wanting to let people know that there is a hazard on the road.

In respect of sirens, the regs state

Police, fire and ambulance vehicles are allowed to use a sirens or similar audible emergency warning devices. Other specifically mentioned permitted users are bomb disposal, blood service, coastguard, mine rescue, RAF mountain rescue and lifeboat launching vehicles. In 2005 the regulations were changed to allow the Ministry of Defence’s nuclear response team and Revenue & Customs to use sirens too.

As far as training is concerned,

There is no requirement for people driving emergency vehicles to be trained beyond a normal driving licence. Drivers of police, fire and ambulance vehicles who wish to be exempted from speed limits will be required to be officially trained.

This rule has been included in a 2006 Road Safety Act but it has not yet been made law.

At present there is no indication as to when it will be made law.

There are concerns that there will be too much demand for the existing driver training courses, but there is also the thught that most blood bikle riders are more competent than may Police drivers as they have been required to undertake training and pass an advanced test before they can ride the bikes in the first place, unlike many Police drivers who now do no more than a 30 minute assessment drive.

Emergency services can use the normal horn or the siren when stationary and at night, unlike the restrictions of a normal car horn.

Some devices that are similar to sirens are allowed on non-emergency vehicles. These include car alarms, reversing alarms and chimes on ice cream vans.

In respect of Green lights....

Green flashing lights can be used on a vehicle that is carrying a registered medical doctor on an emergency call. The green lights do not offer any exemptions from the rules of the road and are surely to alert road users to the importance of the journey and to hopefully ease the vehicle’s progress through traffic.

When green flashing lights are used in conjunction with blue flashing lights, the greater authority of the blue lights give the vehicle more exemptions.

Does that answer your question Paul?


 
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andyBeaker

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I will admit to still being confused here. Sorry!!

Are 'blood' riders exempted from speed limits or not? If I read above correctly they would need to be 'trained'?

Or am I misreading?
 

T.C

Been there, and had one
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I will admit to still being confused here. Sorry!!

Are 'blood' riders exempted from speed limits or not? If I read above correctly they would need to be 'trained'?

Or am I misreading?

At the moment No training is required.

The requirement was included in the 2006 Road Safety Act but that act has not yet been made law, so no training is required and they are exempt from speed limits providing it is a designated emergency, which in this case was determined by the Hospital.
 

andyBeaker

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At the moment No training is required.

The requirement was included in the 2006 Road Safety Act but that act has not yet been made law, so no training is required and they are exempt from speed limits providing it is a designated emergency, which in this case was determined by the Hospital.
To be honest I think that the requirement for training is very sensible. There are plenty of people who can ride bikes fast, there aren't as many who can ride them fast and safely.
 

Murt

Letch
The NW Blood Bikes have a ride assesment by a ROsPA observer before they are allowed to use livered (A&V) bloodbikes.
At first, they had to have ROsPA silver or above before going on the assessment ride, this has now been lowered, but I don't know what happens now as I have severed connections with them ( for other reasons other than not having a bike!).
Their rules then were, you only use A&V when authorised, only to make progress through heavy traffic, and only on one of the official livered bikes.
At first they were quite tight on the rules, but I'm aware it's a bit more ' fluid' now.
They do a great job, but they have a lot of Walters in there now.
Murt.
 
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