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Welcome to the new B.I.R.D. Forum. Please be sure to read the "New Member / New Registered ? Please Read" thread in the Coffee Shop. This contains some important information. To become a full member ( £5.90 a year ) simply click on your user name near the top on the right I hope you enjoy the new site ................ Jaws ( John )
"They" Know Best...
- Thread starter Dark Angel
- Start date
Dark Angel
Still kickin' it!
If you watched the video, above, which recalls the effects of the 2001 foot and mouth “epidemic”, you’ll have noticed (I hope) a reference to “Neil Ferguson”. He’s the man whose recommendations to the government led directly to “the worst slaughter of its kind in British farming history”. It was all needless.
Amazingly, Ferguson is also the man “whose dramatic prediction of 500,000 deaths in the UK became the foundation of Boris Johnson’s U-turn from herd immunity to collective quarantine.” The same man whose work was discredited in 2006 and again in 2012 by Professor Michael Thrusfield of Edinburgh University, an expert in animal diseases.
I couldn't find out why it took five years, and then another six years for Professor Thrusfield to make his views known to the world at large; I suppose nobody asked...
Amazingly, Ferguson is also the man “whose dramatic prediction of 500,000 deaths in the UK became the foundation of Boris Johnson’s U-turn from herd immunity to collective quarantine.” The same man whose work was discredited in 2006 and again in 2012 by Professor Michael Thrusfield of Edinburgh University, an expert in animal diseases.
I couldn't find out why it took five years, and then another six years for Professor Thrusfield to make his views known to the world at large; I suppose nobody asked...
Dark Angel
Still kickin' it!
@andyBeaker Andrew, why have you disagreed with this? Genuine question here, so no obfuscation, no sarcasm and no bullshitting.
Because I see it as a divisive post.
Ok, that's your opinion, but that doesn't necessarily make it disagreeable. Half the posts on here are divisive in one form or another which is, in itself, a divisive comment.
Sometimes called shitstirring
That's what I wanted to say but I would only have got a load of abuse.Sometimes called shitstirring
I find it disagreeable as the poster is continually posting stuff that appears to be aimed at undermining all the great stuff that is going on in these times of global crisis.
Personal view.
There's always more than one side of the story, particularly in something as catastrophic as the situation we now find ourselves in. If DA was, for example, quoting the likes of Comrade Corbinski, Tony B. Liar, Wee Jimmy Krankie, etc. then I'd be inclined to agree with you. However, his posts appear to taken from independent sources with a factual basis (by 'factual', I mean with references to support the claims), thus lending credibility.
'Independent' is the key word here; this is not party political spin or such like.
Further, I have not seen anything that undermines what our key workers are doing
ALL key workers are doing an amazing job. However, if we're being lied to, bullshitted or hoodwinked in any way then we deserve to know and I, for one would like to know.
You are putting a LOT of words in my mouth that I haven't said there!!
Have you hit your head or something? Andrew, I am not putting words in your mouth and I have not quoted you.
All I wrote, admittedly in a convoluted way, is that DA is not, in my view, constantly undermining “...all the great stuff being done...” Instead, he is providing comment from independent sources.
The convolution was necessary in order to explain why, in my view, that DA was not undermining. To explain further, the sources are not anti-establishment lefties aiming to bring down the government and have no apparent agenda. He’s simply providing news and different views from alternative sources, that’s all.
The only thing I can see where you might consider I’ve put words in your mouth is my use of ‘key workers’. A not unreasonable assumption considering “...all the great stuff being done...” but could also be applied to our government, whom I believe are doing a reasonable job. Not brilliant, but none of the other political parties in this country, or any other for that matter, would be doing any better.
Personally I'm beginning to find DA's Covid postings to be in turns depressing, tedious and repetitive... and quite probably pointless.
The simple facts are that no matter what ineptitudes are perpetrated by government and what skulduggery is going on in the background, we are mere bystanders and can do very little, if anything, to change that.
In such circumstances, sometimes ignorance is bliss.
The simple facts are that no matter what ineptitudes are perpetrated by government and what skulduggery is going on in the background, we are mere bystanders and can do very little, if anything, to change that.
In such circumstances, sometimes ignorance is bliss.
Dark Angel
Still kickin' it!
That's quite a statement if you think about what it implies.
I take your point, John, and I've avoided watching the news on a number of days for the very same reasons. This whole COVID-19 bollocks is getting very tedious and it's affecting each and every one of us to some degree. From the safety of my kitchen table, those members on here at highest risk of actually contracting the virus would appear to be Dezza and Ogr1. For others, there are a diversity of issues ranging from job security and financial commitments to the lame stuff like not being able to go to the pub or the gym. Personally, my main worry is Mrs P is still flying and, whilst doing so, she's in very close proximity to a bunch of strangers who may or may not be infected (and that's on top of the usual shite she has to put up with like some stroppy "do you know who I am" type who can't have a cup of coffee on the flight and it's all Mrs P's fault).
Now, back to DA's posts; as I've said above on a number of occasions, he's providing info from alternative and/or independent sources. To my simple mind, it's important to be aware of all sides of the arguments (leaving aside the ignorant bleatings of entitled millennials and lefties). Maybe it's my professional head kicking in here but I'm an expert in my professional fields. Those of you that have stayed awake long enough whilst reading my drivel in the past might recall that I have given expert evidence in courts and arbitrations, in both commercial and criminal cases. What I'm getting at here is an expert's duty to the court which is, inter alia, to give opinion which is "objective and unbiased". Unless I'm missing something here, the only way that's likely to be achieved is by considering ALL of the available evidence, which means listening to the government, the media (unfortunately) and alternative sources.
Whilst we may not like what we hear and read, irrespective of the source of the data, if nothing else it should at least be considered if only, for example, to assist with making an informed choice next time the elections come around. Would you vote for someone who you now know, on the basis of the evidence of your own research, to have lied? What if your local MP was found to be incompetent? Conversely, would you not be satisfied that the person you intend to vote for is going to do a good job on the basis of their stellar performance in handling the COVID-19 crisis?
It's important to keep informed.
Sometimes you have to cast a vote to the person who has lied & cheated less, but I agree the bigger the picture you look at, the better informed you are likely to be.
Yep. Do you honestly think you can change things.? I don't.
I've never been afraid to speak my mind and I've done more than my fair share of "rocking the boat" over the years... both while serving and as a civvy. I've paid the price in terms of lost friends, stalled careers and even a marriage. In my last job I blew the whistle on the boss for lying and fiddling expenses. Guess where that got me..?
I'm only 56 yet I'm dog tired of what feels like a lifetime of being equal parts angry and helpless in the face of a world where a hard core of people hold most of the cards and are invariably in a position to guarantee that the hand you're dealt will depend on whether you play along or not.
Dark Angel
Still kickin' it!
I’ve posted elsewhere that I don’t read newspapers and that I despise politicians per se for what they’ve done to this country; and my greatest despair is that I’m just one of a whole generation that let them get away with it.
Call my posts depressing and tedious and I’ll understand: call them pointless and I’ll wonder if you’re still reading them, or whether you’ve chosen to ignore them, but: I’ll keep on posting them anyway because turning my face to wall and pretending that “there’s nothing I can do about this” isn’t an option for me anymore.
It doesn’t make sense that not only keyworkers, but also every person in the country and most of the others on this planet should be living in mortal fear of something they know nothing about, other than what their governments choose to tell them. Whether we acknowledge it or not, we’re living in a dictatorship; benign, for the time being, but with no guarantees for the future. What’s truly frightening to me is that we’re doing that by choice.
Information vital to the existence of our society is being supressed and/or manipulated by our government; openly, covertly and comprehensively. The most reliable sources for untainted information (or, at least, information that's nearer to being truthful, valid and reliable) are the “independent” sources available via the internet. To the best of my ability, I check the sources I use before publicising them to alert those on this site and elsewhere to the fact that the mainstream media has become untrustworthy - and how and why that is the case.
That is why I say - with great respect and deepest empathy: If people don’t want to know the information, they should exercise their right not to read it.
I understand. But I won’t stop.
Good points Paul, but my perspective is this...
Statistically this planet will one day be struck by some sort of large space debris and it will have catastrophic consequences. It could happen tomorrow or in a million years.
If it gets reported in the news that an asteroid has been spotted and it might hit us in x years then that's enough info for me.
I don't need to know that it might hit here, with major effects, or it might hit there with minor effects. I don't need running updates on the distance it travelled today, yesterday, tomorrow...
The fact is no-one knows what will actually happen because it's never happened before.... so I don't need to hear about everybodies pet theory on what might happen.
And that's my point. You can dig up as many "expert" comments as you like, but ultimately you are hearing educated guesswork. Nothing more.
This is unprecedented and the very fact that no one has cracked it yet speaks volumes about the so called "expertise" that is being touted as fact.
Next time it'll be different I'm sure. We'll have loads of data and plenty of scientific study. But this.. this is roller-coaster and we're not in control because no one knows how to operate the brakes.
Tell me what you're going to do, DA..? Honestly... how are you going to make a difference..?
My choice to make a difference was to work with a few neighbours to set up a community support group and help the vulnerable and housebound.
I don't choose to read your posts, BTW, I have to as a moderator.