braking

[Smix]

ok - two things to make one query!! (I know, should be somewhere else, but thought I'd get more giggles in here!!)


I have a bad habit of locking the rear wheel when braking (and changing down) fast.

also - I've been told I should be giving a little bit of revs in between down changes?




If I learn to do the little blip, is that likely to solve the rear lock ups??



and how do you know how much of a blip and when????




I think that turned into two queries!!! :} :} :}

 

[Samster]

Smix,

Blipping the throttle will solve the lock ups, provided that when you let the clutch back out you are matching the engine speed with the new gear speed (or close to it). Does that make sense?

You don't want to blip and end up with more engine speed than the new gear speed on a downchange or the bike will lurch forward as you let the clutch back out in the lower gear. Personally I would aim to raise the revs to just below an exact match so that you still get a little engine braking. The point of blipping is just to smooth things out............

Someone will explain it better I'm sure...........

 

[roXXo]

ok - two things to make one query!! (I know, should be somewhere else, but thought I'd get more giggles in here!!)


I have a bad habit of locking the rear wheel when braking (and changing down) fast.

also - I've been told I should be giving a little bit of revs in between down changes?




If I learn to do the little blip, is that likely to solve the rear lock ups??



and how do you know how much of a blip and when????




I think that turned into two queries!!! :} :} :}

Certainly changing down without matching the revs will lock the back wheel which is potentially extremely dangerous.

I don't want to sound like an old fart or a clever dick but I am truly amazed that you you don't know how to change gear.
Has nobody taught you you?

Maybe it's a man / mechanical interest thing but I have been riding bikes since I was 13 years old and it was natural that you blipped the throttle. Nobody taught me or my pals. We just knew.

Anyway you must fix this problem Smix and while you can read how to do it or be told how to do it, it much better to be shown.
Get one of the lads to go through it with you.

If this was a wind up and a piss take I have fallen for it.
If not, I really am astounded.
Sorry if I come across as a pompous, know it all tw*t Smix but this is the first time I have ever heard of somebody not blipping the throttle.
Besides matching the revs to the gear it's one of the aspects of riding a bike that make it so aurally pleasurable.

Good luck
:beer:

 

[Smix]

Certainly changing down without matching the revs will lock the back wheel which is potentially extremely dangerous.

I don't want to sound like an old fart or a clever dick but I am truly amazed that you you don't know how to change gear.
Has nobody taught you you?

Maybe it's a man / mechanical interest thing but I have been riding bikes since I was 13 years old and it was natural that you blipped the throttle. Nobody taught me or my pals. We just knew.

Anyway you must fix this problem Smix and while you can read how to do it or be told how to do it, it much better to be shown.
Get one of the lads to go through it with you.

If this was a wind up and a piss take I have fallen for it.
If not, I really am astounded.
Sorry if I come across as a pompous, know it all tw*t Smix but this is the first time I have ever heard of somebody not blipping the throttle.
Besides matching the revs to the gear it's one of the aspects of riding a bike that make it so aurally pleasurable.

Good luck
:beer:

you don't any of what you said. When I took my test (about ten years ago) no one mentioned. and since I and have done virtually all my riding solo, no one has ever really noticed I guess. I've always known I lock the rear on changing down under braking, but to be honest its never bothered me (ok - i thought it was fun c7u8 )


Its only cos someone mentioned it a while ago and how it improves a persons riding. So, I have been trying, but am not sure how/when/how much etc etc!!

I'll have to find someone who knows to go out with for a play and learn!!

thank you :k :k :k



ps - I do kind of get why - used to drive a bus that needed double declutching (or whatever it is called!!) so it makes sense to, just never really thought about matching the revs!! but guess if you haven't been told/taught, you don't necessarily think about it.

 

[Smix]

PPS - I've only been riding for about 5 years, and all my friends have been riding since they were kids, so with it being second nature to them, I guess they never thought I wasn't doing it??? :blush:

 

[Samster]

Smix - click this link - hit play in the media player at the top and turn your volume up. Between 13 and 20 seconds you'll hear the rider blipping the throttle as he comes down through the gearbox............

http://www.audiosparx.com/sa/play/port_lofi.cfm/sound_iid.204248

And here's some better noise from onboard. Blips occur at 20,23,28,33,35 and 37 seconds and then again at 1.00 and 1.03.....

http://www.audiosparx.com/sa/play/port_lofi.cfm/sound_iid.204346

 

[fatboystew5]

Smix, I've only been riding for about 2 years myself, so understand that unless someone tells you, you can't know!

Its great fun matching revs as you down change, particularly when you are pushing on - it makes the whole ride more exciting and smoother.

Try a few gentle practice runs first. Find a nice smooth straight road, perhaps a 40 or 50 mph Dual carriage way, get up to speed and get to say, fourth gear. If you wanted to change down, would you usually roll off the throttle? Try holding a steady throttle, then pull the clutch in (keep the throttle open gently) with the aim that the revs stay about where they are, 3 or 4 thou, not drop down to tick over. Then when you let the clutch out slowly it should blend nicely with no jerks. Next try maintaining a steady speed, note where the revs are, pull the clutch in, incease the revs by about 500 - 1000 rpm (depending on what gear and how much speed you loose while coasting!) and drop a gear and while holding the revs there ease out the clutch - hopefully the lower gear engages smoothly. You may have needed bit more, or less, but that comes with practice! Try getting up to 5th at a moderate speed, say 60 ish, pull the clutch in and gently apply some more throttle, engage 3rd, get the revs to round 7 or 8k and gently let the clutch out - the aim is for the revs to blend smoothly so you can then accelerate in 3rd.

If its not working, ride along at say, 60mph in 3rd and note the revs, then change to 4th or 5th still at 60. When you want to drop back to 3rd, you know what the revs need to be at as you have just noted it, so while in 5th pull the cutch in, drop to 3rd, increase revs to where you know 60mph in 3rd gear is and then gently let out the clutch.

As you get used to it, the 'blipping' is just giving it a couple of twists between downchanges to bring the revs up, ie as you pull the clutch in approaching a corner or whatever, rev it just before you engage the lower gear. Be careful not to incease the revs too much, as the bike will surge forward when you ease the clutch out. Don't forget to brake - the next thing is to master braking with the lever while blipping....

It's no different to driving a car - if you are behind a car in 5th and an overtaking opportunity comes up and you want 3rd for better acceleration, you would dip the clutch and while changing gear apply more gas get the revs higher as 3rd will require more revs at any given speed than 5th...

Hope that makes sense - sure someone will rip it to shreads, but just trying to help!! :-:

 

[silverfox.xx]

Er did you not notice when you were on the back... I'll not say when, or who.

Do you actually use the rear brake along with the front (I know its a linked system)... You may be applying too much rear brake.

 

[BraXX]

I guess the locking of the rear wheel has more to do with changing gears down withou the blip than with the hard braking, did you ever try braking hard with the clutch on? will the rear wheel lock then? (suppose your bike is not de-linked)
About how much revs up, before releasing the clutch, its not a problem, just be sure to blip and release the throttle, so the revs be going down, before you release clutch!

 

[Artemis]

Sorry if I come across as a pompous, know it all tw*t Smix but this is the first time I have ever heard of somebody not blipping the throttle.

Could this just be an example of a woman not being embarrassed to admit something that few men would ever admit to and ask for advice to correct it?

I was also not taught to blip the throttle when I learned three years ago.

 

[roXXo]

Could this just be an example of a woman not being embarrassed to admit something that few men would ever admit to and ask for advice to correct it?

I was also not taught to blip the throttle when I learned three years ago.

Could well be Artemis, but every motorcycle rider I know that I have followed, has "blipped". You can hear it.

I honestly never gave it a thought. Never considered that anyone would not blip.
Well I"ll go to the foot of our stairs.
You learn something knew every day

 

[Crazy Train]

Well, I'm not a blipper, and have never had any troubles changing down, though I know some do blip, I was never taught this.

I sometimes had the opposite problem of wheelspin, but never lock the rear!

Should one blip, can one be arsed? Is it really necesarry, in my measly 7 years of riding I've never found a use for it, just close the throttle, change down and all is smooth. I often use downchanges for engine braking which helps, and co-incides with the whole slowing down process.

and by the way, i want to make my 98 bird accelerate faster, thinking of downsizing the sprocket, any other ideas??? Already tried an iggy advance, but in the winter it idles like poo, so took it out.

 

[Smix]

Could well be Artemis, but every motorcycle rider I know that I have followed, has "blipped". You can hear it.

I honestly never gave it a thought. Never considered that anyone would not blip.
Well I"ll go to the foot of our stairs.
You learn something knew every day

thing is Roxxo that most people I know with bikes started riding as kids, were probably taught by their dad or big brother and learnt all that so it became second nature. If you don't think about it cos its just 'the way its done', you don't ever mention it to anyone!! so others don't know either!! I only found out cos of a comment made about a training day and how it improved someone else's riding! :dunno: but at least posting the question gives me something else to go out and learn!!! :k


Braxx - I have locked the rear under braking with the clutch in, but only once and i think the wet conditions and the slippery white line had something to do with it!!!!!!!!! usually its only under braking when i let the clutch back out - gonna miss wiggle if the 'blip' thing stops it!!!!!! c7u8



Silverfox - do you really want an answer??? It'll be only the lines of - most of thar day is blanked out - the rest is a memory of concentrating on something other than the bike!!!!!!!!!!!:} :} :}

 

[Aidey]

Smix, heres a suggestion which may help. Find a reasonably long stretch of road (the Mendip mile may be good between Chewton Mendip and M-S-N) and ride along about 50mph in 4th gear and note the revs on the counter. Change up and down between 3rd and 5th and note the revs on the counter again. This should give you some idea of the amount of revs between the gears you need when blipping the throttle. You dont need handfuls of revs, about 1500 will do and then start blipping the throttle by that amount as you are riding along and you will soon get the hang off it. Remember to also look where you are going at the same time!

 

[Artemis]

Remember to also look where you are going at the same time!

Ooh, Smixy, he wants you to look where you're going too! Still, he hasn't asked you to navigate as well, so maybe you'll be OK :dunno:

 

[Smix]

Could this just be an example of a woman not being embarrassed to admit something that few men would ever admit to and ask for advice to correct it?

I was also not taught to blip the throttle when I learned three years ago.

got to admit that I didn't know I should be embarrassed not to know when I originally asked although now I'm thinking I should be embarrassed not to know, but can't quite get to embarrassment!!!!!!!!! hey ho!!!




Thank you all lots - I shall go have a play in the next few days and see if I can master it.


Have to say that I am a tad worried a the idea of trying to brake and 'blip' at the same time - as I've said before, I do have silly small hands (not that I'm showing of or owt!!) so have a wierd grip when braking anyway -this exercise could be interesting!!!!!!!!!!!! :}:}:}:}

 

[Smix]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aidey
Remember to also look where you are going at the same time!

Ooh, Smixy, he wants you to look where you're going too! Still, he hasn't asked you to navigate as well, so maybe you'll be OK :dunno:

its ok he's met me - I'm sure that during conversation he worked out I don't do navigation!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL (tis what the TomTom is for!!!) :}:}

 

[Samster]

Ask any bloke/boy to do an impression of a motorbike with their mouth and they'll do the blips when they do the slowing down bit........ the first note of the crazy frog thing is a blip of the throttle.

Being totally honest, yes it does smooth things out and reduce the likelihood of the rear wheel slipping when decelerating, especially if you need to go down more than one gear at a time BUT, I think the main reason we do it in the first instance is that it sounds WICKED, especially with some throaty 'zorsts! After that it becomes second nature. I tend to brake with all fingers and blip the throttle with the base of the thumb.......

Smix, if it feels dangerous then please don't continue to try it - grab a pillion with someone and watch / listen to what they do

 

[silverfox.xx]

Blipping the throttle is not a goot idea when taking a car or bike test... in this case you should be travelling slow enough to change down without the lurch when the clutch is released... bike & car.

I'll sometime blip while changing up, especially at low revs to assist the gears mesh.. when accelerating fast from 3rd gear upwards on the BB, I don't usually use the clutch. 1st/2nd/3rd can be a bit notchy.

What blipping the throttle does is to (changing down) as previously stated, is to, raise the revs to match the increase in revs when selecting a lower gear, it also helps the gears to mesh in easier. This could be difficult as smixxy has short fingers, so the blipping can be done whilst front brake lever braking, I tend to hold the throttle with thumb and 4th/5th fingers and brake with index and middle or just middle if I'm not braking (feathering) too hard.
So the blipping is done while the clutch is pulled in and the gear lever is foot operated, the blip can be initially higher than the 'required' revs but the release of the clutch should be 'judged' to be at the point that the revs in the lower gear will be at. ie if your running in 4th at 3000 rpm, the blip maybe to 3750 rpm and the clutch released at the 3rd gear change of 3500rpm. In other words if your slow at changing down (time to actually do it) you will need to blip higher....

 

[ericonblackbird]

Perhaps there is an age thing here!

As an 'old git' I was brought up on 'tired' Brit Bikes and certainly every Royal Oilfield that I rode needed a handful of revs and a good prod of the right foot to enagage a gear. No blip no gear and often blip and still no gear.

Those youngsters just don't know they are born, gearboxes that don't need 'blipping', what is the world coming to .... they will be fitting flashing direction indicators next and god forbid removing the kick start and replacing it with a motor thingy ................... grumble grumble