It is with regret that I do this, but..

[Jaws]

No need for any explanation..
Everyone knows the score.

This makes me sad..
Apart from anything else it makes me look like some sort of weak arsehole who apparently cannot take a decision.
It aint true and those that know me will know it..

But on the other hand it IS a damned difficult decision ..
Why ?
Cos the man is actually very principled.. he is just not able to present a case without pissing a whole raft of folk off.. and of course he does have a god complex ( look it up ) but for those that canna be bothered, he cannot see the possibility that any opinion other than his one could ever be right

 

[Pow-Lo]

John: I don't think you're being an 'indecisive weak arsehole', not for one second.

I don't think I can ever recall a noteworthy person being banned from here, other than Stevebiker. This cannot be an easy decision to have made. There are some that might accuse you of simply responding to a witch hunt, which, obviously, would be total bollocks; all anyone would need to do is study the threads in which Daisy has been involved and the responses that he's incited. As I've said before, you wouldn't believe how easy it is to get banned from the Rolex forum. One guy, admittedly a complete (but harmless) tit, got banned for continuously telling porkies. He (or she, if you catch my drift) was worse than Tom Pepper.

However, I do disagree with the final option on the poll. I don't think that it would be right for him to remain a member but have his posts on race and/or religion pulled. That then says that there are rules for Daisy and rules for everyone else which, to my simple mind, is a no-no. Either all religious and/or racial posts are pulled or none of them (apart from out and out racial abuse, which should obviously be withdrawn). It's like a partial circumcision; we either go all the way or don't bother.

Anyhoo, I don't pretend to know our Daisy but it seems to me that he's very much a Jekyll and Hyde character. I agree that he's principled and some of his views are actually quite thought provoking; over recent months, he's succeeded in bringing quite a few members back out from under their stones. It's his delivery and his 'bedside manner' that are questionable.

On the other hand his left-wing views and wanting to open the floodgates to illegal immigrants is tolerable in moderation. Any decent argument or debate needs at least two sides. However, I draw the line when Daisy starts sympathising with terrorists. He is also bang out of order when he starts levelling abusive and, when you think about it, quite ridiculous statements about banging other members wives. That, to my mind, is a banning offence in itself. As fellow ex-seamen, Hemmy and John (Quiney) might back me up here, but at sea the rule used to be that you can say whatever you like about 'me' but families are sacrosanct. That's something I still abide by.

I've voted for Daisy to be temporarily banned. If he stopped being such a cock and found a method of delivery that didn't involve personal abuse, he might actually be quite entertaining.

Perhaps this poll could serve as a final warning? Up to you Daisy, you gonna play nicely or not?

 

[Codbasher]

No point in a temp ban, no different from him going quiet for a few weeks, oh and remember he wanted to come a 'visit' me, backfired a bit when I told him I would meet him at the station b0x2

The bloke is just too full of shit to be worthy as a member. C'mon John, hit the delete button and clear up some bandwidth for mor of DK's drivel :-0)

 

[derek kelly]

I too have voted temporary ban for similar reasons to Pow-Lo, you've not been weak John you've been tolerant & given the guy plenty of chances, a temporary ban may give him chance to reflect & come to his own decision that he isn't always right & other people's opinions do count, he may comeback with a different attitude, if not then permanent ban is the only option.

If his posts & his posts alone are being flagged by Google then that speaks volumes.

 

[Saffie]

Jaws I think while you at it. I scrolled through BIRD looking for forum rules and cant find any, maybe it will be a good time to create a "sticky" or locked Sub forum and do one?

I found that the other forums I am on has quite a extensive list of rules:

(1) Please Treat ALL Posters with Respect and Courtesy.-
Anyone who is found to be abusive to another member will be banned at the Admin`s discretion.
Admins and Moderators retain
the right to edit delete or move any post to keep the tone friendly.

(2) Signatures and Pictures
The use of signatures or pictures to abuse or belittle other members will not be tolerated anyone doing this will have their signature removed and recieve a strike under the ban system.Any large pictures in signatures will be re-sized or removed

(3) Admin And Mod jobs ---
Please do not ask to be an Admin or Mod if and when we need to recruit someone we will let you know.

(4) No Trolling -
Do not post comments which have the sole purpose to cause an argument. You may express your opinion on a topic, however abuse to anyone who doesn't have the same opinion as you will not be tolerated. Trolls will be banned.

(5) Keep it legal** -
With all forums we are held responsible for all posts so please beware and think before you post. Any racist or hateful posts will immediately be removed and the poster warned and/or banned or suspended


(6) No Flaming or posting of material intended to start a flame war.--
Forum wars are stupid and childish we will not get involved with them.

(7)Moderating-moderators and admins have a hard job trying to balance between having a laugh and being abusive,if an Admin/mod edits/moves/locks or deletes a post/thread no discussions will be entered into..Admin/mods decision is final..If however this in some way upsets you,send a pm to an admin.Any posts put up regarding these matters will be treated as trolling or attemting to start a flame war and these threads will be removed.

(8) Spamming of any type is not allowed---
Where as some poor forums feel the urge to spam their way to the top we feel that only good honest post makes a forum successful. Any spam will be removed and the offended warned then banned.
Any member found out to be spamming other members with unsolicited pm`s or email to advertise forums and websites will be banned

(9) Word filter ---
It is there to protect everyone on the forum anyone found trying to avoid this will be warned then banned and the post removed.

(10) A three strike system is in effect for any user failing to fully comply with the rules:
First Offence: A warning.
Second Offence: Suspended from the forum for 1 week
Third Offence: A permanent ban.

In severe cases the offender may be banned before making 3 offences.
If you have a problem with any particular user, Please send a PM to the admin. Please do not contact Admin about silly childish petty squabbles.

(11) Complaints
We take pride in our forum however there may be times where some of our members or guest may feel upset. If this is the case please send the Admin a pm clearly stated what you are upset about ,, if you can take a screen shot to back up your claim then please do.
Anyone found to be abusing the complaints system will be removed from the forum.



(12)De-activation
Any members who no longer wishes to be part of the forum may have their account deactivated,the account will then be put into hibernation and the member will no longer be able to access the forum.
If the member wishes at some point in the future to have their account Re activated the may send an email to *removed* and request this.
Once re activated the member will be able to view but not post on the forum for 3 days,this will give them time to decide if the forum is for them or not.
Any post put up saying "I am leaving the forum and won`t be back " etc will be taken as that the member would like the account deactivated,which will be done and the post removed.

(13)Avatars:
Any Avatars containing pornographic/racist/sectarian material will be removed without consultation.
A PM will then be sent by the admin to give an explanation for its removal.
Its our intent to limit the potential for undue offence, hence this rule.

** By Legal we mean

The selling of any material including drugs, guns , knives and any other product under the currant law which is illegal.Making racist comments,asking people to help you "sort people out"and asking where to buy drugs.

 

[Jaws]

We have NEVER required a list of rules before.
There are basically two
You cannot wish a member to have an accident
You cannot place an advert without 10 posts

All the rest have always been self imposed .. as in people behave them selves and control their own behavior by simply being decent human beings
Yes, I have had to take a few folk to task over the years for odd things..
Criticism / censure has been accepted and people have changed what they do

In this case, no matter what has been said, the same behavior continues unabated

 

[noobie]

Apart from anything else it makes me look like some sort of weak arsehole who apparently cannot take a decision.
It aint true and those that know me will know it..

I'd say your right John but please do not confuse with how you may feel, with what others think. I can assure you even more so that you have put it to a vote rather than just slashed with a ban, it shows you are trying to meet all sides

Most who know you will know this situation is not of your own making.

However, it is now impacting on the use of Bird for far too many people and more importantly the probable increase in searches pairing BIRD and racism is not one any site owner can allow, even more so as in this case when it is not true.

On that event, no one person is bigger than the forum and as a site/forum owner you quite rightly have to protect that forum and correct a wrong

you have asked, begged and demanded this slinging of false racist accusation stop and the person concerned has not understood or been willing to understand

As a site owner you have been several times more lenient than most and that should not be seen by you as a weakness but more of a strength of attempt to welcome all shades of opinion and this totally unique situation created may I add not by you but by Davey, should not upstage the continually appreciated positives you and your site offer.

 

[Jaws]

I am gonna leave the poll running until late Monday, giving anyone with an interest the chance to vote.

 

[Rheumatoid]

There are a few on here with what I would consider 'right-wing' views and I have to admit I have become a little tired of them at lately. To my mind they are no more valid than some of the views Davey Bee holds and articulates. However, he is a little more vociferous and aggressive in his delivery at times, occasionally to the point of over-stepping the mark in the eyes of some. I have not read all of the posts recently due to getting bored with the debate so I am not sure about any personal attacks on peoples families, but I would be with Poo Plow on the unacceptability of that.

I am not voting to have him banned as he has done nothing that I have seen that I personally find totally unacceptable. I think we should all be man (or woman) enough to ignore him or engage with him as is our want.

R.

 

[vbird]

I voted no to a ban, in my opinion his manner is awful and inciting, however he is entitled to his opinion, the block button has been available for some time, use it.

when you wish someone to "fuck off and die" the rule we have about "You cannot wish a member to have an accident" is sometimes forgotten. that remark for me overstepped the line, no matter what, this is a bike forum, that sentiment should not be voiced.

Davey, I presume you are reading all this, you do need to take a reality check, you keep poking, I thought at first it was fishing, now I`m not so sure, the way you express your views and your generalisation is bemusing. You do come across as having the god complex, You clearly can`t see "the other side" .

 

[Saffie]

I should seriously start paying more attention, I find that when I am reading forums and see stuff that's not to interest to me I glance over it not taking note, but clearly there are a few posts of Davey I must have missed to get this kind of backlash.

I only had one incident where a regular member took something I said out of context and made me out to be a idiot, I replied and let the water run of my back, worst is I cant even remember who the member was and would probably have a beer with him at a meet.

I get "people" sometimes more than I should. I acknowledge there is very different takes on things, but I still feel one should not feel that you can not voice your opinions on a forum, all news sites have disclaimers"the views expressed by the readers are not necessarily the views of this publication/editor/organisation"

I had to laugh as the racist thing is quite funny.

I am a proudly white South African, therefore I am a racist is a view most ignorant people in the UK shared. I actually retort with jokes to diffuse the situation. IE: I dont hate blacks every white man should own one, etc.. In fact if anyone bothered to get to know me they will find out I am far from racist and shared my life with both white and black friends, but for me they are friends not labelled by color.
The irony here is if I have to be completely honest, lets say I am a racist so we dislike blacks...since coming here I have met some racists that would make the most right winged fanatic look mild. The uk racists hates everyone!! Chinese, pakistani,black,muslim....sheesh at least we only get labelled hating one race.

Since coming to the UK and being exposed to more of the world I have to be honest, but my views on Muslims has changed dramatically.

Now the other side of my family are German, My grandfather was a Waffen SS Panzer Commander and I am bloody proud of this, again society would tell me not to be because what the Germans did, again forgetting most Germans were just obeying orders, at war time refusing a order is treason and immediate execution, unfortunately I will never know what my granddads views were as by the time I had enough brains to want to talk to him he was a damaged man, his brain was letting go of his body faster than he was aging.

As I could not find forum rules on the site, maybe someone can point me to them if I missed it? Davey has broken no rules except for pissing some people off, if we are going to ban people for pissing people off then this forum is no longer for me. If the forum has clear rules in place and a member chose to disobey the rules fair enough ban him, because having rules means the member has read them and decided to join the forum.

As said in my previous posts, I love biking and bikers because of our diversity, if we go down this road...

I voted no to the ban as I do not know the man behind the name.

Simply some people on the forums I would love to meet, ie: Pow Low Andybird, Wolfie as they are come across as solid and nice blokes in real life they might be nobs...who knows, then when I first joined I dunno why but I thought Ianrobbo was a nob..cant remember the details why(might be the red bike), then I met Ian...what a bloody nice guy, he went out of his way to help me when I was in need without ever meeting me, a true gent and biker and I am proud to say a friend!! I am now glad I met him and a few others on here.

Well thats my 2 cents worth.

 

[Rheumatoid]

I only had one incident where a regular member made me out to be a idiot,

sorry about the Coventry comment. Didn't mean to offend 8rfl@

when I first joined I dunno why but I thought Ianrobbo was a nob...

You were right. He is. :-0)

 

[americanexpress]

I have voted the way I have, because I can choose not to read his comments, in the same way that if I offend somebody they can ignore me.

In fact, I was on IanRobbo's ignore list when I first joined because I said something which he found offensive but I think he can see my drivel now.

As I am an adult (in years at least) I have the capacity to choose what I wish to read.

As has been said, everybody is entitled to an opinion, and I don't feel the need to have somebody censoring what I read.

 

[DLN1965]

"Simply some people on the forums I would love to meet, Andybird" as they are "come across as solid and nice bloke in real life they might be knob".

Having met Andy ...... I can truly say in real life he IS a solid and genuinely nice bloke ... On this forum however he is a complete ..........!!!! F1sh1ing

8rfl@

 

[JonP]

Good morning folks. I am relatively new here and have not contributed a great deal. Conversely I have benefitted enormously both directly with you folks answering my questions and offering advice and indirectly by reading past posts on the help pages. It is not often you find a forum where people are prepared to take time to talk to you on the phone to help you out.
Particular thanks to John.

The coffee shop section also serves to keep me amused. I do not agree with everything posted there and that is a good thing. I would be worried if I did!

I have voted against a ban for one very simple reason. If not for the 6 or more pages that followed the post that brought the vote about (seems to have been removed now?) then there really would not have been an issue.

I know that original post offended some of you but it wasn't until later in the thread that the OP actually started to label individual members.

The original post was designed to get a reaction and it succeeded. No reaction no more posts.

For the record I welcome people like this making comments such as he does. Not because I agree with his views but because it makes people look at their own views and realise that they are not racist for Having the opinion on out of control immigration that they do. That they are not anti Islamic for fearing the extremists and fundamentalists.
In short it makes people realise that the term racism has been invalidated through constant mis-use and we are becoming less scared of its use.
Judging by the speeches at the Tory conference this week even the government are learning this lesson.

It also seems that popcorn sales go up when post's like this are active. p0pc0rn41

 

[Barrie]

Seeing as how Ian Robbo has been mentioned. To me, Ian and many others on here are the backbone of the forum. So much so, no one else really matters. Those who come one here purely to promote their own political agenda are not worth bothering with. Leave them on here John, they make me appreciate the "Real" people on here, many of whom I am proud to count among my friends. You know who you are.

 

[Centaur]

Seeing as how Ian Robbo has been mentioned. To me, Ian and many others on here are the backbone of the forum. So much so, no one else really matters. Those who come one here purely to promote their own political agenda are not worth bothering with. Leave them on here John, they make me appreciate the "Real" people on here, many of whom I am proud to count among my friends. You know who you are.

Thank you, Barrie. 8rfl@

 

[Demonbane]

i love lumpy and andybird , the conflict they produce is in my opinion how it should be done.

i see daveyb's posts as nothing more than malicious,inciteful, hateful and quite frankly fucking rude!

i vote ban

theres wankers and there is obnonoxious shit stirring !!!!! of wankers who are more than happy to hide behind a computer and troll shit at everone

 

[Centaur]

I don't want him banned.

I dislike his on-line persona immensely but appreciate the lack of rules on here. After blowing my stack at him some time ago I now just ignore his posts.
To me the only reason to ban someone would be if they continued to make totally unacceptable comments such as wishing someone on here dead or injured; after a single warning. If we starve him of publicity by ignoring him he will take his obnoxious manner elsewhere. We have had a previously well-known and respected member on here who in my opinion made a fool of himself by repeatedly attacking another member. His posts were largely ignored and he now rarely posts.

 

[Jaws]

Hi JonP.

I have voted against a ban for one very simple reason. If not for the 6 or more pages that followed the post that brought the vote about (seems to have been removed now?) then there really would not have been an issue.

It has not been removed at all mate..
And if the issue was only relating to that thread then there would never have been a need for a poll at all.

This incident is merely the latest in quite a history of similar things