• Welcome to the new B.I.R.D. Forum. Please be sure to read the "New Member / New Registered ? Please Read" thread in the Coffee Shop. This contains some important information. To become a full member ( £5.90 a year ) simply click on your user name near the top on the right I hope you enjoy the new site ................ Jaws ( John )

You'll Hate this Fook off!

Duck n Dive

Rebel without a clue ...
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I think the reasoning goes that basically all the companies will end up charging to the price cap as they're not making money.

When I say not making money that's the "distribution to consumer" bit not making money. All the profit is taken out upstream in a tax efficient way.

But if you're a company that only supplies then your stuck between a rock and a hard place. That's why so many of the little guys that were touted as evidence of competition have vanished.

That's why so many organisations have been structured into stand alone companies rather than one large old fashioned company. That way you can shape where the profits/costs/taxes go to maximise the earnings.


The standing charges are going up to recoup the losses from the companies that went bust.

The deal was the others took the customers and outstanding charges on. They got whatever money wasn't in the kitty plus they had to honour the customer balances.

Your account might have been in credit to the tune of a few hundred pounds.
You kept the "notional" credit when you were moved to a new supplier.
But that money didn't actually exist, it was gone when the company went bust.

Your new company is recovering that via the standing charge.

The alternative at the time would have been to tell everyone that whatever money/credit they thought they had was gone and they had to start with zero at the new supplier.

The scheme to keep the existing balance with the new company and recover via the standing charge avoided facing the consequences straight away and spreading it over a longer time period.
 

Minkey

Ok it was me
Club Sponsor
It is OAP's that really worry me.
A single OAP gets just £8000 PA.
I can see a lot of heart ache in the coming months

I do wish to goodness the media would stop with the bullshit meaningless blurb re prices
Average Joe needs to know what unit prices are rising to ( at least an average unit price )
For most, the touted 'PRICE CAP' is meaningless

Biggest bugbear and unwarranted hike is the standing charges
Twice in recent days reps from energy companies have been put on the spot to explain and neither could give a direct answer
I was shouting at the telly.. the answer is simple and a single word.. PROFITEERING
I know some OAPS who definitely don't need any help they are very well off, there's a lot of hard working people on minimum pay who are struggling to make ends meet. A lot of people including myself fall between two stools we are not on benefits and we are not pensioners so not getting the extra those two groups are getting
 

andyBeaker

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Club Sponsor
I know some OAPS who definitely don't need any help they are very well off, there's a lot of hard working people on minimum pay who are struggling to make ends meet. A lot of people including myself fall between two stools we are not on benefits and we are not pensioners so not getting the extra those two groups are getting
As an aside I am aware of a number of pensioners locally who are by choice not claiming £100 that they are entitled to via a scheme by the local county council.
 

ogr1

I can still see ya.....
Club Sponsor
Well, even businesses are bricking it.
Had to do an energy survey at work.
That even included the lights in the
fish tank....I kid you not.
 

Cougar377

Express elevator to hell
Staff member
Moderator
Club Sponsor
I think the reasoning goes that basically all the companies will end up charging to the price cap as they're not making money.

When I say not making money that's the "distribution to consumer" bit not making money. All the profit is taken out upstream in a tax efficient way.

But if you're a company that only supplies then your stuck between a rock and a hard place. That's why so many of the little guys that were touted as evidence of competition have vanished.

That's why so many organisations have been structured into stand alone companies rather than one large old fashioned company. That way you can shape where the profits/costs/taxes go to maximise the earnings.


The standing charges are going up to recoup the losses from the companies that went bust.

The deal was the others took the customers and outstanding charges on. They got whatever money wasn't in the kitty plus they had to honour the customer balances.

Your account might have been in credit to the tune of a few hundred pounds.
You kept the "notional" credit when you were moved to a new supplier.
But that money didn't actually exist, it was gone when the company went bust.

Your new company is recovering that via the standing charge.

The alternative at the time would have been to tell everyone that whatever money/credit they thought they had was gone and they had to start with zero at the new supplier.

The scheme to keep the existing balance with the new company and recover via the standing charge avoided facing the consequences straight away and spreading it over a longer time period.
Starts the post with "I think the reasoning goes that basically..." and then writes War And Peace: The Sequel. :risas3:

You, sir, are a legend. :applaudit:
 

DEG5Y

Been there, and had one
Club Sponsor
Simple answer to the energy bills crisis, turn all the power stations back on.
Stop buying energy from Johny foreigner!
 

Pow-Lo

Make civil the mind, make savage the body.
Club Sponsor
Simple answer to the energy bills crisis, turn all the power stations back on.
Stop buying energy from Johny foreigner!
Electricity comes from power stations, but that ain’t the problem. Gas is and we have to import most of it. The bulk of ours comes from the ragheads, Saudi if memory serves, but now the Russians are being boycotted most others are turning to the Gulf, too. Supply and demand.
 

andyBeaker

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Club Sponsor
It’s simple supply and demand. For instance Germany sourced 80% of their gas from Russia, it’s now 30%. So demand has increased elsewhere while supply has also decreased - Russia are now apparently venting and burning excess gas as nobody other than their very few allies will buy it.

Also no doubt traders will be lining their pockets by showing typical lack of morals and pushing prices through the roof by controlling the supply. Similar in some ways to the state of California being subject to blackouts (1990s?) , not Because there was a shortage of power but the traders (mainly at Enron) controlled the supply as well as selling the commodity.
 

DEG5Y

Been there, and had one
Club Sponsor
Electricity comes from power stations, but that ain’t the problem. Gas is and we have to import most of it. The bulk of ours comes from the ragheads, Saudi if memory serves, but now the Russians are being boycotted most others are turning to the Gulf, too. Supply and demand.
I don't think our local power station, Fiddlers Ferry, was ever taken off coal.
 

ogr1

I can still see ya.....
Club Sponsor
Electricity comes from power stations, but that ain’t the problem. Gas is and we have to import most of it. The bulk of ours comes from the ragheads, Saudi if memory serves, but now the Russians are being boycotted most others are turning to the Gulf, too. Supply and demand.
Don't we get a healthy supply of gas from
Norway?
 

Pow-Lo

Make civil the mind, make savage the body.
Club Sponsor
Don't we get a healthy supply of gas from
Norway?
About one third comes from Norway, give or take. We have a little of our own in our sector of the North Sea (according to Wee Jimmy Krankie, it’s hers) but I read recently that could run dry by 2030. The rest is imported, mainly from Gulf States and the US; as far as I’m aware, we were only taking about 4% of our total supply from Russia, but I’m happy to be corrected if someone has more up to date knowledge.
 

andyBeaker

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Club Sponsor
About one third comes from Norway, give or take. We have a little of our own in our sector of the North Sea (according to Wee Jimmy Krankie, it’s hers) but I read recently that could run dry by 2030. The rest is imported, mainly from Gulf States and the US; as far as I’m aware, we were only taking about 4% of our total supply from Russia, but I’m happy to be corrected if someone has more up to date knowledge.
I am pretty sure you are right (even a broken clock is right twice a day :couch:) historically we have only had a small part of our supply from Russia - the issue is that global supply has reduced quicker than demand (apparently demand has reduced as you would expect when prices go up - I know we are consciously using less, sure plenty others doing the same) so the price goes up. Economic theory suggests that the price will come down again as a) demand reduces and b) production increases to take advantage of higher prices ……….therefore c) it follows that supply increases and the price goes down.

Capitalism at it‘s finest, but better than the other options……
 

Minkey

Ok it was me
Club Sponsor
Apparently we are now buying gas from the land down under by the ship load
 
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