For all you EV haters

[Pow-Lo]

I have a Jaguar XE at the moment but am looking to change it probably next year as its 9 years old & approaching 90k miles. A diesel version but goes well enough when you hit the go pedal.

Had a Merc & BMW and don't think I'd go back to either. Narrowed it down to another Jag, a Land Rover Discovery sport or possibly Range Rover. It's likely to only do longer journeys as we tend to use Mrs Ls car for the shorter ones, so I'm looking for comfort over distances without the range anxiety of EVs. Plus I can't afford new anything & don't trust 5 year old battery cars & that's about the age I'm looking at & can afford

Be extremely, exceptionally, very careful if looking at a Range Rover. Get an insurance quote first. Ask Oldandbald

 

[Pow-Lo]

I finally got around to watching the EV programme recommend by andyBeaker on Sunday night. Whilst Beaker's summary is about right, there's a couple other things that stood out to me.

1. The script writer and/or narrator is/are a fuckwit(s). The first meaningful sentence out of Ms Halfpenny's gob was "...by 2030, we'll have to give up petrol for electric cars." No. The sale of new petrol and diesel cars is to be banned from 2030, not the giving up of petrol. Dickhead(s).

2. The thing that really put me off electric vehicles, probably for life, is that the claimed range by the manufacturer can be out by up to 40%. Forty f'ing percent! If that's not tantamount to fraud then I don't know what is. When these outlandish figures are published, they are apparently based on ideal ambient conditions, including temperature, wind direction, humidity, etc., and do not include the use of any other power-consumables, such as wipers, lights, music, aircon, heating, etc. Further, the calculations assume no acceleration. Talk about unrealistic! Ok, mpg of proper engined cars is also based on ideal conditions, but they aren't over-egged by 40%!

3. The side-by-side test of two identical (apart from the colour) Kia cars was interesting, too. One driver drove 'normally' insofar as keeping up with traffic, sitting at the speed limit, using the heater and electric heated seats, etc. and the other drove as efficiently as possible. After a 130 mile drive, the spirited car was at 29% battery and the other was at 54%. Interestingly, the most efficiently driven car was calculated to have a maximum range of 230 miles, some 50 miles short of the claimed 280 mile range.

4. Unbelievably, there are four different types of charger plug connections on the market. That, to my simple mind anyway, is staggeringly stupid. After all the fuss a few years ago about the waste generated because mobile phone manufacturers were all using different connections, and they all finally agreed on USB-C, why are there four different plugs? We have Type 1, Type 2, Tesla Supercharger, and the other one (I can't remember what it's called). How f'ing dumb is that?

I'm sticking with my 3 litre Panzers thanks, even if one of them is gay petrol.

 

[andyBeaker]

I don't hate EVs. Like almost everything else, they have their place and their function. If I was purely office based, one of these would make perfect sense for me; my commute is 17 miles total per day, so I could likely get away with charging a half decent one every three weeks or so.

For Mrs P, who commutes to Heathrow, it would be an absolute nightmare and ostensibly unworkable unless she bought one of the loooo-oooo-ooodicrously expensive ultra-high range models. A trolley dolly she flew with recently lives in, and commutes from, Bridgend to Heathrow, which is about 155 miles each way give or take. Silly Knickers bought a second hand Nissan Leaf. After leaving home, she has to stop at Magor services to recharge and again at Reading. When she had a car with a proper engine, she used to allow four hours for her commute but now she has to allow for closer to six. On the way home, she has to do the reverse. Now imagine doing that after an 11 hour night flight home from, say, LA, San Francisco or something. She obviously never thought that through particularly well. She wants to go back to a car with a proper engine but will get stiffed on trying to shift a crap EV (soz, but the Leaf is crap) with two previous owners.

In five short years from now, if I want a new car, I'll be forced to buy a f'ing EV. I am not ok with that. If the idiots who we elected to represent and look after us gave up on the climate lie and allowed the sale of ICE cars alongside EVs, I'm thinking more people might take up the EV because they'd have the ability to buy the car they want with the powertrain of their own choosing instead of being railroaded into something they wouldn't ordinarily want.

Some areas where I live, it is not physically possible to charge an EV at their own home. In the Valleys, a significant number of the populous open their front doors onto the pavement of a main road and there's double yellows. They have no rear lane access. Assuming they have a car, where do they charge an EV? The daughter and S-i-L of a dear friend of mine have just bought a used EV, a f'ing Leaf no less, and they have nowhere to charge it, so where it needs charging one of them has to take it to a local supermarket and sit there for a couple of hours. The worst thing is, they were warned about this before they bought it. Twats.

Buying a Leaf is the equivalent of buying a Model T in the petrol market. First generation technology…there is a reason why they can be picked up so cheap.

You reinforce my current thinking…EV are ideal for running round locally and more so if a home charger is available, and even more so if that is supported by solar or wind/water turbine.. The reality for me is that if I were to buy a small EV to run locally the Bavarian Magnificence Wundermachine would probably come out of the garage once a month on average.

The overall reality is that we have to get away from relying on fossil fuels before A) they run out and B) we ruin the planet even more than we have already by using them

 

[Pow-Lo]

Buying a Leaf is the equivalent of buying a Model T in the petrol market. First generation technology…there is a reason why they can be picked up so cheap.

You reinforce my current thinking…EV are ideal for running round locally and more so if a home charger is available, and even more so if that is supported by solar or wind/water turbine.. The reality for me is that if I were to buy a small EV to run locally the Bavarian Magnificence Wundermachine would probably come out of the garage once a month on average.

The overall reality is that we have to get away from relying on fossil fuels before A) they run out and B) we ruin the planet even more than we have already by using them

Yep, there's a reason why I referred to her as Silly Knickers.

My friend, who I referred to in another post, who's daughter and SiL bought a used Leaf shook her head in disbelief when I told her what they said about the Leaf in the EV programme. They use the Type 1 charger plug, which is now apparently obsolete and there are limited charging facilities apparently available.* You might recall the same pair of twats have no off-road parking and have to travel to the nearest supermarket to charge the bloody thing .

*I have to say "apparently" because I'm taking the word of those who wrote the programme.

Again repeating myself, if I was purely office based, or only travelled overseas, an EV would suit me down to the ground. However, I just don't want one.

 

[johnboy]

I was going to opt into our company car scheme, our scheme is electric only. I tested the Lexus RX450, loved it but the real world mileage was pitiful so a non starter. The likes of Skoda and VW have a handy mileage calculator on their websites and again woeful real world mileage. Would have gone for a BYD Sealion but the cost to me was enormous so again no thank you, I finally opted for my own lease again of a Kia Sportage PHEV after having a Volvo XC40 PHEV. The Kia has a range of 42 miles on electric and 400 plus (right foot dependant) on petrol, so ideal for me.

 

[sr71caspar]

I find it interesting that the EV advocate, trying to persuade us all to buy one tomorrow- doesn't actually own one himself.



More 'do as I say, not do as I do'.

 

[Oldandbald]

Be extremely, exceptionally, very careful if looking at a Range Rover. Get an insurance quote first. Ask Oldandbald

Yep good advice. But you can insure them for sensible money if you live in a decent risk postcode which I fortunately do. Mainly due to the other cars round here being heaps of shit that nobody wants to steal.

 

[Oldandbald]

I finally got around to watching the EV programme recommend by andyBeaker on Sunday night. Whilst Beaker's summary is about right, there's a couple other things that stood out to me.

1. The script writer and/or narrator is/are a fuckwit(s). The first meaningful sentence out of Ms Halfpenny's gob was "...by 2030, we'll have to give up petrol for electric cars." No. The sale of new petrol and diesel cars is to be banned from 2030, not the giving up of petrol. Dickhead(s).

2. The thing that really put me off electric vehicles, probably for life, is that the claimed range by the manufacturer can be out by up to 40%. Forty f'ing percent! If that's not tantamount to fraud then I don't know what is. When these outlandish figures are published, they are apparently based on ideal ambient conditions, including temperature, wind direction, humidity, etc., and do not include the use of any other power-consumables, such as wipers, lights, music, aircon, heating, etc. Further, the calculations assume no acceleration. Talk about unrealistic! Ok, mpg of proper engined cars is also based on ideal conditions, but they aren't over-egged by 40%!

3. The side-by-side test of two identical (apart from the colour) Kia cars was interesting, too. One driver drove 'normally' insofar as keeping up with traffic, sitting at the speed limit, using the heater and electric heated seats, etc. and the other drove as efficiently as possible. After a 130 mile drive, the spirited car was at 29% battery and the other was at 54%. Interestingly, the most efficiently driven car was calculated to have a maximum range of 230 miles, some 50 miles short of the claimed 280 mile range.

4. Unbelievably, there are four different types of charger plug connections on the market. That, to my simple mind anyway, is staggeringly stupid. After all the fuss a few years ago about the waste generated because mobile phone manufacturers were all using different connections, and they all finally agreed on USB-C, why are there four different plugs? We have Type 1, Type 2, Tesla Supercharger, and the other one (I can't remember what it's called). How f'ing dumb is that?

I'm sticking with my 3 litre Panzers thanks, even if one of them is gay petrol.

I'll forgive you the gay petrol one providing you keep at least one diesel on the fleet. I can't be left to smog up the planet on my own.