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What would you do?

Pow-Lo

Make civil the mind, make savage the body.
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Been round to his place this morning and done a job for him, he still has not said anything about it so I'm keeping schtum also.
We generally keep ourselves to ourselves, we are on very good terms with all the neighbours ( all 8 households) and it would really upset me if they turned as he has done loads for all of them too, he's the sort of bloke that will help anyone out.
You are right in what you say, mud sticks, I don't believe the press should be allowed to report anything from any court until found guilty as innocent people are marked for life.
Best way, IMHO.

Given he’s done loads for your neighbours also, he sounds like a decent bloke and they really ought to think twice before tarring and feathering him.

Question: is he a bit soft in the head? I’m not being a twat here; where I’m going with this is does he have enough intelligence to know better or is someone trying to take advantage of a vulnerability that he might have? Another thing that entered my head is that if said girl and your mate are not local to each other, it might be that it was one of those unfortunate encounters where he was flattered by the attention of a younger girl (or she played up to attention of an older man).

Also, as it appears to have been consensual, as opposed to rape, I’m leaning towards giving him the benefit of the doubt. I say ‘leaning towards’ because I’m not so sure I’d be quite so understanding if it was my daughter. It’s a tough one.
 

T.C

Been there, and had one
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I don’t disbelieve that’s what you were told but past that it sounds like complete total 100% garbage.
I will vouch for Derek on this. It has happened on several occasions.

If....The defendant genuinely believes that the female was of consenting age, then that is a statutory defence in law, and it is not uncommon for the magistrate or the trial judge to instruct said female to wear what she would normally wear when socialising outside of school.

Many kids have tricked elder males into believing they are older than they actually are and when covered in all the slap and muck and dressed accordingly (as many do) it is an easy trap for young males to fall into.

So what Derek has said is perfectly feasible and can and does happen if the courts are switched on or the defence lawyer has half a brain.
 

slim63

Never surrender
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Mid forties.
At that age he should have enough wits to suspect the girl could be underage, I know its a fine line but any bloke in that position should be wary and if he wasn't than that's his lookout

If on the other hand he knowingly did the deed then as you obviously have some land and presumably own a shovel you are two thirds of the way to having the perfect solution
 

T.C

Been there, and had one
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At that age he should have enough wits to suspect the girl could be underage, I know its a fine line but any bloke in that position should be wary and if he wasn't than that's his lookout
There have been a few 50+ who have been seduced by some real youngsters who looked older than they were. Lets face it if you have a female who looks early 20's stroking your ego (and I did mean ego) egging him on, being wary does not make you guilty of anything other than being made to look stupid and cause a whole load of grief.

Common trick used by female blackmailers.

Perhaps he should have been more suspicious, but who has not done things in the past which in hindsight was a stupid thing to do?
 

Cougar377

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There have been a few 50+ who have been seduced by some real youngsters who looked older than they were. Lets face it if you have a female who looks early 20's stroking your ego (and I did mean ego) egging him on, being wary does not make you guilty of anything other than being made to look stupid and cause a whole load of grief.

Common trick used by female blackmailers.

Perhaps he should have been more suspicious, but who has not done things in the past which in hindsight was a stupid thing to do?
Yep. Mr. Wiggly did my thinking for me is something we've all been guilty of at sometime.

With the exception of Beaker , of course.
 

andyBeaker

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I will vouch for Derek on this. It has happened on several occasions.

If....The defendant genuinely believes that the female was of consenting age, then that is a statutory defence in law, and it is not uncommon for the magistrate or the trial judge to instruct said female to wear what she would normally wear when socialising outside of school.

Many kids have tricked elder males into believing they are older than they actually are and when covered in all the slap and muck and dressed accordingly (as many do) it is an easy trap for young males to fall into.

So what Derek has said is perfectly feasible and can and does happen if the courts are switched on or the defence lawyer has half a brain.
I will absolutely stand corrected on this…..my understanding is that ignorance is no defence in ’under age’ cases, with culpability or not being reflected in sentencing?
 

DEG5Y

Been there, and had one
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If somebody is in a nightclub, were age is concerned, then you are probably off your guard as everybody in that nightclub should be well over the age of consent.
Anybody that is under age has already convinced the doorman they are older and probably the barman so why not the clientel?
 

derek kelly

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I will absolutely stand corrected on this…..my understanding is that ignorance is no defence in ’under age’ cases, with culpability or not being reflected in sentencing?
Ignorance is no excuse however when a fifteen year old girl dresses up to look twenty & tells you she is twenty I don’t think it is classed as ignorance.
There was a case several years back whereby both parents encouraged their daughter (14 or 15) to dress provocatively & visit nightclubs, she would lure victims to an alley near the nightclub & the Father would then act enraged & blackmail the victim, as I recall the Father got 8 years & the daughter & Mother each got a suspended sentence
 

andyBeaker

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Ignorance is no excuse however when a fifteen year old girl dresses up to look twenty & tells you she is twenty I don’t think it is classed as ignorance.
There was a case several years back whereby both parents encouraged their daughter (14 or 15) to dress provocatively & visit nightclubs, she would lure victims to an alley near the nightclub & the Father would then act enraged & blackmail the victim, as I recall the Father got 8 years & the daughter & Mother each got a suspended sentence
Slightly cross purposes derek…ignorance is not a defence in law (’i didn’t realise it was a thirty limit’), but I am checking my understanding of how it works for under age cases.
 

derek kelly

The Deli lama
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The difference is balance of probability, the girl was in a night club, she was buying alcohol, she was dressed provocatively (dodgy ground) she told me she was twenty, there is no reason to doubt her. Ignorance doesn’t come into it in this case.
 

andyBeaker

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The difference is balance of probability, the girl was in a night club, she was buying alcohol, she was dressed provocatively (dodgy ground) she told me she was twenty, there is no reason to doubt her. Ignorance doesn’t come into it in this case.
cross purposes,Derek.

My belief, and as I have said I will stand corrected, is that under age sex involving an adult is an offence full stop ie regardless of ignorance of age and as such ‘acquittal’ is not an option.
 

T.C

Been there, and had one
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The difference is balance of probability, the girl was in a night club, she was buying alcohol, she was dressed provocatively (dodgy ground) she told me she was twenty, there is no reason to doubt her. Ignorance doesn’t come into it in this case.
Forget balance of probability, (that applies only to civil law).

To be convicted the prosecution will have prove beyond all reasonable doubt which as you probably know is a completely different test.
cross purposes,Derek.

My belief, and as I have said I will stand corrected, is that under age sex involving an adult is an offence full stop ie regardless of ignorance of age and as such ‘acquittal’ is not an option.
Yes it is an offence, but the key word is "Knowingly" and so acquittal is an option or if they do convict then there is an option of an absolute discharge.
 

slim63

Never surrender
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There have been a few 50+ who have been seduced by some real youngsters who looked older than they were. Lets face it if you have a female who looks early 20's stroking your ego (and I did mean ego) egging him on, being wary does not make you guilty of anything other than being made to look stupid and cause a whole load of grief.

Common trick used by female blackmailers.

Perhaps he should have been more suspicious, but who has not done things in the past which in hindsight was a stupid thing to do?
I do agree and also admit to doing some extremely stupid things in the past

The point I was trying to make is that by the age of 40 most of us have enough life experiences to make a reasonable judgement if some youngster were to stroke our ego's

So taking that into account the case rests on did he know or was he fooled ?
Or more accurately the result rests on how the "offender" and "victim" present themselves in court and the quality of the defender and prosecutor as none of us will ever know the full truth!

(note not knowing the full details offender and victim can and often are interchangeable)
 

JayTee

Si vis pacem para bellum
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I’d say trust your instincts on the guy and your own conscience. The law is a blunt instrument and often doesn’t take into consideration the girl may have lied about her age and may be promiscuous, your mate may have been misled into a situation that was criminal without his knowledge, he may have acted in good faith whilst she may not have, unfortunately this may be very hard to prove in court and if there’s a big disparity in age it never bodes well :(.
As Cougar said “There but for the grace of god etc” .
 

Cougar377

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You're single, divorced, middle aged and you've maybe not had your leg over for some time. You're flattered by the attentions of what, to all intents and purposes, appears to be a young woman.
Circumstances lead to you being offered the opportunity of a bit of horizontal exercise.

If you were in that situation, how many on here, hand on heart, wouldn't jump (no pun intended) at the chance...

Easy to sit in your ivory tower and say emphatically "oh no, not me".....but I think the reality would be that in those same circumstances described above, most of us would struggle to pass it up.
 
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slim63

Never surrender
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You're single, divorced, middle aged and you've maybe not had your leg over for some time. You're flattered by the attentions of what, to all intents and purposes, appears to be a young woman.
Circumstances lead to you being offered the opportunity of a bit of horizontal exercise.

If you were in that situation, how many on here, hand on heart, wouldn't jump (no pun intended) at the chance...

Easy to sit in your ivory tower and say emphatically "oh no, not me".....but I think the reality would be that in those same circumstances discribed above, most of us would struggle to pass it up,
"struggle" yes but if in any doubt walk away (probably with an awkward gait :) )

And lets be honest what half decent 19-20 year old would be interested in any of us fugly geriatrics anyway its got to ring some warning bells even in the daftest of us
 

Cougar377

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"struggle" yes but if in any doubt walk away (probably with an awkward gait :) )

And lets be honest what half decent 19-20 year old would be interested in any of us fugly geriatrics anyway its got to ring some warning bells even in the daftest of us
Never underestimate the hypnotic control of Mr. Wiggly.... particularly potent when under the influence of alcohol.
 

Pow-Lo

Make civil the mind, make savage the body.
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"struggle" yes but if in any doubt walk away (probably with an awkward gait :) )

And lets be honest what half decent 19-20 year old would be interested in any of us fugly geriatrics anyway its got to ring some warning bells even in the daftest of us
As I was told when I first went to sea: “a standing cock has no conscience.”
 
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