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A proper hero

derek kelly

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I bet that not once in his life did he regard himself a hero.
RIP a true hero.
 

T.C

Been there, and had one
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Yes a hero.
My question though is why the brave aircrew who died flying for Bomber command don't get the recognition they deserve something like 50,000 men died hero's all of them

This was covered in a documentary a while back.

Apparently, Bomber command were accused of mass murder of civillians (or something along those lines) and were considered unworthy of recognition until recently.

It was not the public that did not feel gratefull to the crews, but the beaurocrats in Whitehall, hence it is only recently that a national memorial to those lost in Bomber Command has been erected.

Or something along those lines, I can't remember specifics.

But can you imagine an 18 year old today doing what these real hero's did back in the day? Puts some perspective into the difference in generations doesn't it? And I don't think anyone ever thought of themselves as heroes. They were just doing their job.

Hard to believe that only 5 winners of the VC are still alive.....
 

andyBeaker

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This was covered in a documentary a while back.

Apparently, Bomber command were accused of mass murder of civillians (or something along those lines) and were considered unworthy of recognition until recently.

It was not the public that did not feel gratefull to the crews, but the beaurocrats in Whitehall, hence it is only recently that a national memorial to those lost in Bomber Command has been erected.

Or something along those lines, I can't remember specifics.

But can you imagine an 18 year old today doing what these real hero's did back in the day? Puts some perspective into the difference in generations doesn't it? And I don't think anyone ever thought of themselves as heroes. They were just doing their job.

Hard to believe that only 5 winners of the VC are still alive.....
Bang on. The bigwigs (including Churchill) distanced themselves from the carpet bombing after the war. Were happy to support it as an extremely unpleasant means to an end at the time.

The heroes of Bomber Command were finally recognised too late. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAF_Bomber_Command_Memorial
 

slim63

Never surrender
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Yes a hero in the true sense of the word RIP fella

I have to say the word hero annoys me when bandied about in the media with regards to some overpaid twat that happens to be able to kick a ball or some other such pointless activity but those who served deserve the title & our upmost respect !
 

andyBeaker

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Yes a hero.
My question though is why the brave aircrew who died flying for Bomber command don't get the recognition they deserve something like 50,000 men died hero's all of them
There is a programmed called Air Wars scheduled for 8am tomorrow (Sunday) on Discovery that looks like it may be on this precise subject.

Episode 2 is about the Doolittle Raid, an extraordinary event carried out by very brave men.
 

andyBeaker

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One of these gents deserves the ribbons and gongs that he wears....


View attachment 43388
Medals are strange things . My great grandfather served in The Merchant Navy and I have his log book, other assorted papers and a large collection of medals. My research suggests that the medals are all 'campaign' medals, but it would be good to know more. His log book is extraordinary - he spent a lot of time going to and from South America, quite a thing around 100 years ago.
 

Cougar377

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There is a programmed called Air Wars scheduled for 8am tomorrow (Sunday) on Discovery that looks like it may be on this precise subject.

Episode 2 is about the Doolittle Raid, an extraordinary event carried out by very brave men.

One of the things that I can't fathom is how the bomber crews managed to do their job under the circumstances. During WW2, infantry and naval personnel (both above and below) were either in a semi-permanent state of combat readiness - because they were on a frontline of some sort (whether on the battlefield or the high seas) - or they were not, because they were away from the frontline and off the battlefield for R&R or refit.

Mentally, you soon adjust (more or less) to the proximity of the battlefield, the stresses of combat and the evidence of injury and death because (like most things in life) if you subject someone to something for a prolonged period of time their tolerance to it adapts and adjusts. Then when you're away from the frontline it is usually for a reasonable period and you can, to a reasonable degree, wind down.

Bomber crews, on the other hand, went to the battlefield for a few hours and then returned to relative "normality". For a few hours you were in combat, surrounded by the ever present threat of injury or death and then (provided that you returned) for the following few hours or days you acted as if nothing untoward had happened and the world was a sane and pieceful place. They then repeated that (often nightly/daily) for months or more and when they came to the end of a tour most would have a week or two off and then return for more.

The mental strain on the crews of Bomber Command and the USAAF who had to turn it on and off on an often daily/nightly basis can't really be imagined by us today and I take my hat off to them.
 

andyBeaker

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One of the things that I can't fathom is how the bomber crews managed to do their job under the circumstances. During WW2, infantry and naval personnel (both above and below) were either in a semi-permanent state of combat readiness - because they were on a frontline of some sort (whether on the battlefield or the high seas) - or they were not, because they were away from the frontline and off the battlefield for R&R or refit.

Mentally, you soon adjust (more or less) to the proximity of the battlefield, the stresses of combat and the evidence of injury and death because (like most things in life) if you subject someone to something for a prolonged period of time their tolerance to it adapts and adjusts. Then when you're away from the frontline it is usually for a reasonable period and you can, to a reasonable degree, wind down.

Bomber crews, on the other hand, went to the battlefield for a few hours and then returned to relative "normality". For a few hours you were in combat, surrounded by the ever present threat of injury or death and then (provided that you returned) for the following few hours or days you acted as if nothing untoward had happened and the world was a sane and pieceful place. They then repeated that (often nightly/daily) for months or more and when they came to the end of a tour most would have a week or two off and then return for more.

The mental strain on the crews of Bomber Command and the USAAF who had to turn it on and off on an often daily/nightly basis can't really be imagined by us today and I take my hat off to them.
And they were volunteers!
 

Cougar377

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"Never volunteer for anything"..... I think that saying was around when the Romans were over here.
 

Steve Ashby

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My eldest grandson was eighteen yesterday, although he is a lovely lad and we love him to bits, I can't conceivably imagine him at the controls of a warplane. I can visualise him on a computer game saving the universe, again, but if it came to the real deal I don't think him or any of his mates would have the 'moral fibre' that the elder generation had. It's not his or their fault, the world is a different place entirely now and I'm not running any of them down but we will rarely see the like of the WW1 or WW2 again. Big respect.
 

Cougar377

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My eldest grandson was eighteen yesterday, although he is a lovely lad and we love him to bits, I can't conceivably imagine him at the controls of a warplane. I can visualise him on a computer game saving the universe, again, but if it came to the real deal I don't think him or any of his mates would have the 'moral fibre' that the elder generation had. It's not his or their fault, the world is a different place entirely now and I'm not running any of them down but we will rarely see the like of the WW1 or WW2 again. Big respect.

I used to wonder whether the current crop could deal with the stresses of the battlefield. I certainly had my doubts. Then I recently read a book called "No Way Out" by Adam Jowett (Major) about the mixed Airborne and Irish Rangers unit that he commanded in Helmand Province and how they defended the regional district centre in Musa Quala against all comers.

Quite an eye opener and I can guarantee it'll make you think again about whether the youth of today can hack it.
 

Steve Ashby

Registered User
I used to wonder whether the current crop could deal with the stresses of the battlefield. I certainly had my doubts. Then I recently read a book called "No Way Out" by Adam Jowett (Major) about the mixed Airborne and Irish Rangers unit that he commanded in Helmand Province and how they defended the regional district centre in Musa Quala against all comers.

Quite an eye opener and I can guarantee it'll make you think again about whether the youth of today can hack it.
I'll have a look at that,quite willing to be convinced but I'm not sure that on while on his pc he's smoking hot, in real life there isn't a reset or start again button.
 
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